ESB Hop Schedule

[bullfrog]

Okay, so I'm kegging a batch tomorrow and I've decided I'd like to brew an ESB. This'll be the first ESB I've done so I thought I'd ask for some help with it. I've already got my grain, so they're going to remain the same (unless people think that some quantities should be altered) but just wanted to get some advice on the hop schedule.

Batch Size: 23L

4.00kg Marris Otter
1.00kg Munich I
0.20kg Crystal
0.10kg Dextrine
0.10kg Naked Oats

30g Fuggles @ 60 minutes
40g EKG @ 20 minutes

Nottingham yeast fermented at 17C.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Cheers

[drsmurto]

Not sure what your OG or IBU is so that makes commenting hard.

Ignoring that, i would halve the 20 min addition and add the remaining 20g of EKG at flameout.

Next time i would suggest getting a good english yeast to get some yeast derived esters which play a crucial part in english bitters.

I've never used the naked oats before (I have 1kg ready to go but never figured out what they are used for) but you would probably want to at least double that to be able to taste it. 100g of less is more of a colouring addition IMO.

I doubt i need to give my opinion on dextrine malts (assuming you are referring to carapils)

[bullfrog]

Yeah, the dextrine malt is carapils and is for head retention reasons -- I've been having some problems with that of late. The oats are just for mouthfeel, I'm told. Was told (by my LHBS dude) that 100-150g is enough to add just that bit of noticeable silkiness to the mouthfeel.

Only using Nottingham because it's the only English yeast I've got. Could always run back to the LHBS and grab some S04, as they only stock the Safale and Saflager dried yeasts (unless I special order) but I thought Nottingham might have been a better option.

Expected OG is 1.052 with an expected FG of 1.013. The IBUs will come out around 27.5 if I halve the EKG and add the rest at flameout.

[Planner]

4.00kg Marris Otter
1.00kg Munich I
0.20kg Crystal
0.10kg Dextrine
0.10kg Naked Oats

30g Fuggles @ 60 minutes
40g EKG @ 20 minutes
Cheers

Bullfrog

I'm not sure how you've done it, but you have constructed nearly the exact recipe that I drafted earlier today from 900k away.
Went to G&G while in town today and collected Fuggles & Styrian and 500g of naked oats (which I've never used before) I already have a supply of EKG, Crystal and Munich 1.
Paul at G&G listened to my hopeless description of the nutty, biscuity taste I was wanting and emerged with the naked oats for a taste, not exactly sure what it will produce, but I'll give it a whirl.

Edit: picked up some WY1968 while there, for my first try with a liquid.

[bullfrog]

Perhaps it's not an ESB but ESP...?

How much of the oats were you going to launch into yours, Planner?

[drsmurto]

25 IBU is way too low, you need at least 35 to balance it, my preference is for closer to 40 with that OG particularly given that you are adding Munich.

Do you have any other hops you could use?

As for the oats giving silkiness, flaked oats yes, not sure that naked oats (which i understand are malted) will.

[Bum]

Craftbrewer (shop!) says: "Naked Oats will deliver a deep golden hue with light caramel flavors to the finished beer as well as a creamy, satin finish". Perhaps they've worked out a way to malt this one and retain some of that creaminess?

[bullfrog]

The original IBU for the hop schedule in the OP was 31.5-32. I'm now thinking something along the lines of:

30g Fuggles @ 60
20g EKG @ 60
20g EKG @ 20

That puts me at 38 IBU's. Would a flameout addition still be advisable?

[bullfrog]

Craftbrewer (shop!)

I like how you specify lest somebody think you're referring to a certain megalomaniacal wanker from Townsville

EDIT: Out of interest I just went and read the description you refer to. They seem to think that 4-15% of the grist would be the optimal usage. I've upped them in my recipe to 250g, making them 4.5% of the grain bill.

[Bum]

One can't be too careful.

[Planner]

How much of the oats were you going to launch into yours, Planner?

LHBS suggested not more than 200g, I'm thinking more like 100g for a first try. As with most of my recipes, this one is changing constantly.
Current thinking is now might be the right time to try a mild.

20l batch
3000g Pale malt
100g Med. crystal
100g Naked oats
45g EKG 60min
10g EKG 10min
10g Styrian 10min
10g Styrian flameout
WY1968
OG 1036
IBU 31.6
70deg mash or is this not needed because of the lower attenuation of 1968

[drsmurto]

The original IBU for the hop schedule in the OP was 31.5-32. I'm now thinking something along the lines of:

30g Fuggles @ 60
20g EKG @ 60
20g EKG @ 20

That puts me at 38 IBU's. Would a flameout addition still be advisable?

That looks good to me. If you want to add a flameout addition what hops do you have available?

[bullfrog]

Would still have another 20g of EKG that I could use. Despite that, I've got a crap-load of American hops, so they're out, Fuggles, Willamette, Northern Brewer...

Actually, what would be the thoughts as to swapping out the first addition of Fuggles with Northern Brewer to the same IBU?

[drsmurto]

Add the 20g of EKG at flameout. Keep the rest the same.

[speedie]

what are naked oats dudes
where do all these names come from

[Bum]

From homebrew shops? Golden Naked Oats is a malted oat from Simpsons. Other maltsters probably sell them but neither of my sources carry them.

[Planner]

Batch Size: 23L

4.00kg Marris Otter
1.00kg Munich I
0.20kg Crystal
0.10kg Dextrine
0.10kg Naked Oats

30g Fuggles @ 60 minutes
40g EKG @ 20 minutes

Nottingham yeast fermented at 17C.

Bullfrog

Did you pu this down last month? I got sidetracked and only got brewing on saturday, will pitch WY1968 tonight. Interested to here your thoughts on the naked oats.

Planner

[bullfrog]

Yes mate, got it down in the end. It got tapped last week and it's heavenly. I've had to disconnect it from the tap, lest I drink it all before it's had a chance to age a bit.

It is definitely a very full-bodied beer and I'm guessing a lot of that comes from the oats. I'll be definitely throwing them into the next bitter that I do (along with a few other styles that could do with them, too.) Silky mouthfeel that I don't normally get in my brews, as well, and there's a definite sweetness to the malt profile of the beer, and I didn't use a whole lot of crystal in there, so I'm guessing that the oats are adding a bit of that, too.

Just so you know, the original recipe got changed to include 250g of the oats, not the 100g that I originally posted.

[Planner]

Just so you know, the original recipe got changed to include 250g of the oats, not the 100g that I originally posted.

Thanks Bullfrog, good to here you enjoyed it.

I put 2 brews into cubes this weekend past, 1 for WY1968 & 1 for WY1469. Both had 100g of oats as a testdrive. Still 300g at home if I like the results.
My brews are only 18l & 20l.

[Planner]

20l batch
3000g Pale malt
100g Med. crystal
100g Naked oats
45g EKG 60min
10g EKG 10min
10g Styrian 10min
10g Styrian flameout
WY1968
OG 1036
IBU 31.6

Bottled this last night, couldn't believe how clear the WY1968 flocced. Normally I see a few things floating about when bottling, but this time none. I didn't CC, just bottled straight from primary at 20deg (admittedly it had been sitting for 4 weeks). Very much looking forward to this one, got a couple of stubbies to open at about 10 days.