Guinness AG recipe

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Postby Trough Lolly » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 2:57 pm

I'd recommend MO ahead of the BB malt but that said, I'd do a batch using either and compare in a tasting. I've heard good reports on BB malt - I have two sacks in the cellar right now!

Galaxy is an excellent base malt for big bocks if you like them, such as the Erdinger Pikantus Dunkel Weizenbock...

Cheers,
TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 2:59 pm

What is your dough in process for a temperature mash such as this TL?
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby Trough Lolly » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 3:05 pm

Depends on what your mashtun is - cylindrical, rectangular, etc.

I have a 10 Gallon rubbermaid cooler - whirlpool the strike water and drop in the grains without stirring. The whilpool ensures the grains go into solution with almost no stirring, doughballs or risk of oxidising the mash with frantic stirring. You could underlet the mash if you wanted to get high tech, but I tend to add grist to water and not vice versa.

Cheers,
TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 3:19 pm

I have a rectangular mash tun, my method is to add 1L less than recommended water to the tun. Pour the grain in and mix it down as I go. Then top off with hot/cool water to hit strike temp. Sounds pretty much like what you do. Though I was not aware it was bad to oxygenate the mash water, I will keep that in mind. The BIAB guys must have a hard time of it ;)
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby drsmurto » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 3:21 pm

So much talk about grains to water or vice versa. I have tried both and prefer adding the grains to the water but with a rectangular esky for a mash tun, i cant whirlpool so i do have to get a bit vigorous with stirring afterwards to ensure no dough balls.
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Postby lethaldog » Wednesday Nov 07, 2007 3:25 pm

I have a round esky and have tried both, i much prefer to add the grain to the water these days as it mixes through better and i always found with the opposite that i had always some down the bottom that i couldnt mix in properly :wink:
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Postby drsmurto » Wednesday Nov 21, 2007 10:57 am

Ok, so i AM brewing this on the weekend.

Question - since guinness is a drier, smoother stout than others such as the Coopers BE stout, would adding the roast barley towards the end of the mash help this out. From what ive read it will reduce the amount of roast flavours which are very subdued in a guinness.

First run of my mill. Very excited.

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Postby Trough Lolly » Wednesday Nov 21, 2007 12:24 pm

Doc, I'd suggest it's not a matter of when you added the RB, but how much...

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TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Wednesday Nov 21, 2007 12:50 pm

I have to agree with TL, it is quantity that will make the difference. Mine should be ready to bottle tomorrow, I will let you know how it tastes from the fermentor.
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby drsmurto » Thursday Nov 22, 2007 12:31 pm

From the reports i have read the guinness recipe is roughly 70/20/10 - pale/flaked/roast

Not too concerned if i end up with more oomph than a guinness. Might just teach my irish mates that guinness isnt the only stout in the world :lol:

Kev - eagerly awaiting your tasting notes
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Postby Trough Lolly » Thursday Nov 22, 2007 12:41 pm

G'day Doc....There are a few links on stout that I can highly recommend:

The PenSans Brewery article on an Irish Dry Stout is worth a read - click here...
and Roger Bergen's excellent article on stoutsthat I mentioned earlier, is a good starting point too.

IMHO, the choice of pale malt is pretty important - as of course are the choices you make on hops and yeast - but I've found that Bairds Marris Otter and Bairds Stout Malt (aka Pale Ale malt) are very good for this style; if you can find them.

I lurk on the Irish Craftbrewing forum so I'll have a look around for a good "home grown" dry stout recipe there as well!

Cheers,
TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Thursday Nov 22, 2007 1:02 pm

Hey Doc, the recipe is on my website if you want to have a look. The roasted barley was home made using pearl barley and it is very subtle. I am very impressed with the body of this beer, it is nothing like Guinness but that is probably due to the home roasting. I do however think if I had used commercial Roasted Barley it would have been overpowering. The bitterness is perhaps a bit too high I think 40 IBUs would have been perfect!
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby drsmurto » Friday Nov 23, 2007 11:16 am

Ok ,so have read and re-read this post and the links provided a few times now.

Ordered my spec grains, picked up my chiller, hop screen and refract yesterday so ready to go.

Final recipe is this
3.50 kg Pale Malt, Ale (Barrett Burston) (5.9 EBC) Grain 70.00 %
1.00 kg Barley, Flaked (Thomas Fawcett) (3.9 EBC) Grain 20.00 %
0.50 kg Roasted Barley (Joe White) (1398.7 EBC) Grain 10.00 %
30.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] (60 min) Hops 17.2 IBU
22.00 gm Northern Brewer [9.10 %] (60 min) Hops 22.9 IBU
OG 1.046, IBU 40.1, EBC 86.9
Wyeast 1084

Going to save the MO for my next few ESBs as i dont have much. Dropped eff to 65% with all the flaked barley. Didnt get time to get to the HBS so couldnt order the rice hulls to aid sparging so will just have to deal with cloudiness this time. Dropped flavour addition after reading the links on the thread.

I think this is a very simple looking recipe - good for my first AG stout as i can then complicate it at a later date.

Cheers for all the input/advice/discussion etc
DrSmurto

EDIT - just had a look at the irish craftbrewing forum and the recipe i saw was remarkably similar! I think i might buy a few cans of guinness to savour whilst brewing
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Postby Trough Lolly » Friday Nov 23, 2007 12:05 pm

Looks good Doc!

Here's a Guinness draught clone recipe off the Irish Craftbrewer forum:
Niall K wrote:I plan on brewing Dave Lines draught Guinness Clone this week and need you opinions please. This is his actual recipe. I know the grain ratio seems to be correct but the hop amounts I think are a bit too high. When I put the recipe into BeerSmith the IBU come out at 89.6 IBUs. I know Guinness should be around 45 IBUs. What do you think I should do? Will I cut back on the hop amounts or leave it alone as Dave Line planned it to be.

Amount Item % or IBU
3.17 kgs Pale Malt Grain 70%
0.91kgs Barley, Flaked Grain 20.1%
0.45 kgs Roasted Barley Grain 9.9%
85 grm Northern Brewer (7.0%) (60 min) Hops 67 IBU
28.3 grm Brewers Gold (7.1%) (60min) Hops 22.6 IBU

Looking forward to you replies.
Thanks
Niall


The hop schedule looks a bit high and I'd go for Bullion hops over Brewers Gold, but the rest of the ingredients look very close...

Cheers,
TL
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Postby drsmurto » Monday Nov 26, 2007 9:47 am

Its in the fermenter but i really should observe the golden rule of not starting on the beers before adding hops. Ended up with 19L @ 1.048 which is what i was aiming for, give or take a litre. But i was using my plate chiller for the first time. Started off very slowly and noticed brew was coming out at 20/21C on the first pass. But i had a visitor so i sped it up and ended up with a 30C wort so couldnt pitch the fully swollen smack pack. Dumped it in fridge but forgot to change setting from 4 to 18....... Went to a wedding after (without cleaning up brewery), got slaughtered on LCPAs and woke up next morning to discover wort at 4C and smack pack still swollen. Pulled it out of the fridge and dumped into yeast and left for golf. Got back and realised i still hadnt cleaned brewery. Mash tun reeked! Kettle still smelt nice tho. So checked this morning and wort/fridge is at 20C but still no action. Not impressed with myself. Have a sachet of Nottingham handy to pitch if needed but will give it another 24hours before panicking. Not happy, shot a 104 at golf, worst score by a long way in nearly 3 years. Think i will try and stay off the booze this week and get back some needed points for the silly season ahead.
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Postby Trough Lolly » Monday Nov 26, 2007 9:55 am

Congrats on starting a new beer style - Guinness Dark Lager!! :wink:

Cheers,
TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Monday Nov 26, 2007 4:38 pm

You probably just chocked the yeast by pitching it to a wort that was so cold. I would be willing to bet with another day at proper temp it will take off just fine. You have taken a gravity reading so just check it again tomorrow.
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby Trough Lolly » Monday Nov 26, 2007 7:12 pm

Agree...you probably sent the yeast dormant, like we do when we put the bottles in the fridge - you wouldn't have killed the yeast and a day or two at room temp will sort the yeast out. Don't try to rush the warming process, just let the fermenter come up to room temp by itself and the yeast will follow...

Cheers,
TL
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Postby Kevnlis » Monday Nov 26, 2007 7:36 pm

Chocked? I meant "shocked" ;)
Prost and happy brewing!

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Postby drsmurto » Tuesday Nov 27, 2007 11:34 am

You were right Kev/TL. Got home last night to the familiar bloop bloop sound of the airlock and a nice inch high krausen. Turned the fridge down a touch to see if i cant hold it at 17 (assuming the fermenting temp is a degree or 2 higher).

First time i have used the fridge to brew something other than pilsners. Damn it stinks, like when you leave a fridge switched off and closed. Think i will be giving it a good clean with bleach inbetween brews.....
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