Timothy Taylor Landlord

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Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Wednesday Apr 16, 2008 3:45 pm

Tapped this on the weekend, my 3rd attempt at nailing a Timothy Taylor Landlord clone.

Mach 1 was 98% MO, 2% JW caramalt - not bad but not malty enough
Mach 2 was 94% Mo, 6% melandoidin - very hoppy, melanoidin is out of whack

Hopping schedule has been the same for all. Mach 1 used wyeast 1098 and since then i have been using the supposed Timothy Taylor yeast - 1469.

Here is Mach 3 - the best of the lot. Malt is there, hops are not as in your face as Mach 2. Balanced. At last. Lighter in colour than the real thing but i dont care!

3.75 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 92.59 %
0.30 kg Munich I (Weyermann) (14.0 EBC) Grain 7.41 %
45.00 gm Fuggles [4.40 %] (60 min) Hops 25.2 IBU
30.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [4.50 %] (20 min) Hops 10.4 IBU
30.00 gm Styrian Goldings [4.70 %] (20 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs TTL (Wyeast #1469) [Starter 2000 ml] Yeast-Ale

20L - OG 1.044, IBU 35.6, EBC 9.6

Mashed in at 65, mash out 78.

This one is now my house ale. Can drink it all year round!

Cheers
DrSmurto
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby rwh » Wednesday Apr 16, 2008 3:54 pm

w00t. I'll be making one of those!
w00t!
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Trough Lolly » Wednesday Apr 16, 2008 4:17 pm

Image

Wheeler, G and Protz, R, 1998, Brew Your Own British Real Ale, CAMRA Ltd, p.145.
Timothy Taylor Landlord

A superb beer of enormous character and complexity, from the Knowle Spring brewery in Keighley. Stunning, mouth-filling, multi-layered interweaving of malt and hop with intense hop and fruit finish.

OG: 1042, 10.0o Plato

For 23 litres:

4280g Golden Promise pale malt

39g EK Goldings hops (7.9% A/A) at start of boil
32g Fuggles hops (4.5%) at start of boil
15g (Styrian) Goldings hops (5.3%) at 15 mins
Irish moss at 15 mins

WLP022 Essex Ale yeast

Mash at 66C for 90 mins. Boil time 90 mins. Racking gravity 1009, 2.3 degrees Plato.
4.4% abv, 35 IBU, 10 EBC, 6 SRM.


Cheers,
TL
(I can also source Timothy Taylor Best Bitter if req'd...) :wink:
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Chris » Wednesday Apr 16, 2008 8:26 pm

Anything you don't know TL? :)
A beer in the hand is worth two in George Bush...

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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Ross » Wednesday Apr 16, 2008 9:41 pm

Trough Lolly wrote:Image

Wheeler, G and Protz, R, 1998, Brew Your Own British Real Ale, CAMRA Ltd, p.145.
Timothy Taylor Landlord

A superb beer of enormous character and complexity, from the Knowle Spring brewery in Keighley. Stunning, mouth-filling, multi-layered interweaving of malt and hop with intense hop and fruit finish.

OG: 1042, 10.0o Plato

For 23 litres:

4280g Golden Promise pale malt

39g EK Goldings hops (7.9% A/A) at start of boil
32g Fuggles hops (4.5%) at start of boil
15g (Styrian) Goldings hops (5.3%) at 15 mins
Irish moss at 15 mins

WLP022 Essex Ale yeast

Mash at 66C for 90 mins. Boil time 90 mins. Racking gravity 1009, 2.3 degrees Plato.
4.4% abv, 35 IBU, 10 EBC, 6 SRM.


Cheers,
TL
(I can also source Timothy Taylor Best Bitter if req'd...) :wink:


They might use 100% GP, but i reckon some of it is crystal. the above recipe does not come up like TTL; colour alone is way too pale & 15gms @ 15mins of Styrian is not going to give you the wonderful TTl aroma. Have you tried it TL?

cheers ross
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Thursday Apr 17, 2008 11:04 am

Saw that recipe floating around TL but after discussing the recipe with many TTL fans the hop schedule i used was deemed more appropriate. As Ross said, you need a big styrians aroma and thats what i get. 1.5g/L at flameout seemed a little excessive to me but the aroma is magic.

Floor malted GP isnt available here so after discussing the recipe with Wessmith he suggested i bump up the maltiness with some munich and not worry too much about the colour.

Took his advice and its a dead set winner. The bottles of TTL i bought recently were oxidised so couldnt do a side by side comparison but to be honest, i am not that worried. It tastes sensational and i achieved one of my goals - to brew a bloody nice ESB. Will stick to this recipe and play around with others hops/malts/yeasts etc to make other ESBs.

Damn i love english ales! :D

Cheers
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby rwh » Thursday Apr 17, 2008 11:18 am

drsmurto wrote:Damn i love english ales! :D

Me too!

Oh, right you already knew that... :oops:
w00t!
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby warra48 » Thursday Apr 17, 2008 5:15 pm

drsmurto wrote:
Damn i love english ales! :D

Cheers
DrSmurto


What's not to love? She's a beauty of the first order.
And I love American Pale Ales, Märzens, Porters, etc etc etc, aawwww geez, I just love beer.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Brewaholic » Thursday Apr 17, 2008 10:07 pm

Be very interested if you grunt like an ape after a few pots :)
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby tazman67 » Friday Apr 18, 2008 12:53 am

Would love to see the TT Best Bitter recipe TL ?
I brew the beer I drink
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Trough Lolly » Monday Apr 21, 2008 1:59 pm

Ross wrote:They might use 100% GP, but i reckon some of it is crystal. the above recipe does not come up like TTL; colour alone is way too pale & 15gms @ 15mins of Styrian is not going to give you the wonderful TTl aroma. Have you tried it TL?
cheers ross


G'day Ross,
No, I haven't brewed this exact recipe - I have an essex ale recipe that does use Bairds Amber Ale malt (I bought a sack for this style of ale) to give the coppery gold colour profile. Crystal would work and I have also enjoyed using 100% Bairds Marris Otter as the grist. In defence of Mssrs Wheeler and Protz, I think it's also worth noting the fine print that suggests a 90 minute boil which may help out colour-wise.

Doc / Ross - Agree that the 15g of hops may be a bit light - perhaps they were referring to fresh whole flowers and not pellets? Whatever the outcome, I see that Michael Jackson also remarked on the aroma of the beer;

"Timothy Taylor's has been using the same yeast for at least 30 years. It is a hybrid of the John Smith's and former Oldham Brewery yeasts, and Mr. Hey reckons it produces a beer with a "polished" clarity, firm "mouth-feel" and quenching finish. Open fermenters are used, too."

He also said:

"Before the glass coded "R" reached my lips, my senses were aroused by the aroma of hops. If you think that sounds fanciful, you have never had a truly hoppy beer. This was such a brew. The hop is a resiny flower, and here it was at its aromatic best, as sharp as the zest from an orange-skin. At first sip, I doubted we could taste a better ale among the seven finalists."


Jackson's TTLL hop schedule differed from the original Camra receipe - he suggested Fuggles for bittering, Goldings for flavour and Styrian Goldings for aroma and apparently suggested a hopback. A local brewclub member also noted that Protz eventually confirmed Jackson's hop schedule back in the Encyclopedia of Wine, Beer and Spririts (2000).

The original hop schedule - Styrian and Fuggles for bittering and Goldings for aroma - has been modified to reflect the Michael Jackson profile.

And finally, an apology - to Doc! :oops: I certainly didn't mean to "stomp" your excellent recipe - which looks great btw and the MO / Munich I combo is a favourite of mine.

Cheers,
TL
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Timothy Taylor Best Bitter

Postby Trough Lolly » Monday Apr 21, 2008 2:04 pm

tazman67 wrote:Would love to see the TT Best Bitter recipe TL ?


Image
Wheeler, G and Protz, R, 1998, Brew Your Own British Real Ale, CAMRA Ltd, p.144.

Timothy Taylor Best Bitter

A golden bitter of exceptional quality and drinkability. Full and complex grain and fruit with deep, dry nutty finish.

OG: 1037, 9.2o Plato

For 23 litres:

3600g Golden Promise malt
220g crystal malt

22g Styrian Goldings hops (7.9%) at start of boil
26g Fuggles hops (4.5%) at start of boil
10g Goldings hops (5.3%) at 15 mins
Irish moss at 15 mins

Mash at 60C ((that's wot it says!)) for 90 mins. Boil time 90 mins. Racking gravity 1009, 2.2o Plato. 3.8% abv, 24 IBU, 17 EBC, 9 SRM.


Cheers,
TL
Last edited by Trough Lolly on Thursday May 08, 2008 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby rohanbutler » Tuesday Apr 22, 2008 10:12 am

Hey Guys,

Have been following this with interest as although I have not tried Landord myself, several mates with excellent beer taste have come back from the UK and have raved about this beer.

First question where in Victoria would you source some of this for a taste test(admittedly I haven't looked hard at Dan Murphys)

Secondly, I would like to try and brew something like this (would impress said mates I could come even close to this beer), but I'm only set up for the Trough Lough Partial Mash In the kitchen for the moment, so any suggestions on converting to a partial recipe?

Thanks,

Rohan
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby tazman67 » Tuesday Apr 22, 2008 10:57 am

Thanks TL, looks great ! looking forward to brewing these when lager "season" is over. Or...buy myself another temp controller for ales 8)
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Trough Lolly » Tuesday Apr 22, 2008 2:39 pm

rohanbutler wrote:Hey Guys,

Have been following this with interest as although I have not tried Landord myself, several mates with excellent beer taste have come back from the UK and have raved about this beer.

First question where in Victoria would you source some of this for a taste test(admittedly I haven't looked hard at Dan Murphys)

Secondly, I would like to try and brew something like this (would impress said mates I could come even close to this beer), but I'm only set up for the Trough Lough Partial Mash In the kitchen for the moment, so any suggestions on converting to a partial recipe?

Thanks,

Rohan


Hi Rohan,
I'm sure there are bottleshops in Melbourne that would stock Madonna's favourite beer - TTLL ale - it wouldn't be at a regular drive thru; you'd need to go to a place that prides itself on it's range of imported beers...But you should find it or at least place an order for it, if you shop around.

English Bitters are easy to convert from all grain to extract. In this case, I would recommend light liquid malt extract and a modest (<250g) addition of crystal malt or Caramunich I if you have it. I'll assume that you will do a concentrated / non-full volume boil and you'll need to increase the size of your hop additions to compensate accordingly. Some recipe software will help sort out the details...

You might want to consider dry hopping the aroma addition of Styrian Goldings in your primary, or better, secondary fermenter before bottling / kegging. As Doc mentioned in his original post, aim for an OG of around 1.044 and if you're not yet ready for liquid yeast, you might want to use Windsor British Ale dry yeast for this brew.

Cheers,
TL
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Wednesday Apr 23, 2008 12:37 pm

No worries TL. My attempts arent spot on clones, would never try to claim such but its a tasty ESB nonetheless.

sampled a few more pints on the weekend now that my overcarb issue has been solved (got a bit too energetic during the force carbing) and i reckon i might add 1-2% english crystal next time. The difference in esters between 18 and 20 is huge. I might go back to 20C for the next one.

Still tempted to try a 100% vienna version........
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby rohanbutler » Wednesday Apr 23, 2008 2:55 pm

Hey guys,

How does this look (straight out of beer smith),

21L
1.50 kg Pilsner Liquid Extract (6.9 EBC) Extract 32.97 % (in 12L boil)
1.50 kg Pilsner Liquid Extract (6.9 EBC) Extract 32.97 % (after boil)
1.30 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 28.57 % (In boil)
0.25 kg Caramunich Malt (110.3 EBC) Grain 5.49 % (in boil)
45.00 gm Fuggles [6.10 %] (60 min) Hops 39.1 IBU
20.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] (20 min) Hops 4.8 IBU
15.00 gm Styrian Goldings [4.80 %] (20 min) Hops 3.5 IBU
15.00 gm Styrian Goldings [4.80 %] (Dry Hop 5 days) Hops -
Est Original Gravity: 1.045 SG Est Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 4.35 %
Bitterness: 47.3 IBU Est Color: 15.5 EBC

I have used the pilsner liquid extract, as it was the lightest liquid extract o beersmith, but I in reailty I would use prolly cooper Light liquid male extract. I was going to make it a 23L batch but cut it back to 21 in order to achieve a slightly higher OG. I was playing around with the ingredients in order to try and get that OG up and it didn't seem to matter what I did to the Marris Otter, it just wouldn't effect my OG, is this right?

My preference would be to use the TTLL (Wyeast #1469) liquid yeast the Doc has been using but, I can't find any reference to this yeast strain anywhere. Not in beersmith, not on wyyeast's website not on g&g's list on their website. Maybe I'm suffering from the evolved strain of domestic blindness, "internet blindness" (a term I use for people who ring me @ work to get information that is clearly available on the web if they look!)

Thanks,

Rohan
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby gregb » Wednesday Apr 23, 2008 5:41 pm

rohanbutler wrote:... cooper Light liquid male extract.


There's a girls' version? :lol: :lol:

I crack myself up...

Cheers,
Greg
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Kevnlis » Wednesday Apr 23, 2008 5:49 pm

gregb wrote:
rohanbutler wrote:... cooper Light liquid male extract.


There's a girls' version? :lol: :lol:

I crack myself up...

Cheers,
Greg


I was just hoping he wasn't doing the extraction himself! :shock: :lol:
Prost and happy brewing!

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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Trough Lolly » Wednesday Apr 23, 2008 8:03 pm

I'm pretty sure that Wyeast 1469 is not a regular strain - you may have to order it in specially and wait.

Cheers,
TL
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