Timothy Taylor Landlord

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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby chadjaja » Monday Dec 13, 2010 6:56 am

Winsdor wouldn't attenuate nearly enough for this brew imo.

I've always found it very hard to give a personal opinion on something I haven't used :wink:
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Monday Dec 13, 2010 10:16 am

If you did use windsor in this beer you would need to mash lower to account for the lower attenuation of the yeast when compared to Wy1469 (as pointed out by a few people before me).

With WY1469 i mash at 65C, I'd probably go down to 63C if i was to use Windsor.

I've used Windsor before in a lower OG beer precisely due to its lower attenuation.

With english beers i would seriously recommend sticking with liquid yeast, there are so many that produce a wide range of esters.

I understand the convenience of dry yeast but given the few that are available you are limiting yourself.

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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby SimonG » Wednesday Feb 16, 2011 10:23 pm

Hey Guys

I just made a batch of this recipe for the first time last weekend and I have got the wort sitting in a cube whilst I make a starter, as per Dr Smurto's instructions, to pitch into the fermenter and to store some aside for later use, (its my 1st time using liquid yeast so I didn't realise that I needed to start this a few days prior to brewing). My LHBS didn't have any Wy1469 in stock but they did have Wy1968 and Wy1275 off the recommended list of yeasts from earlier on this thread. The guy at the LHBS recommended the Wy1275 so I bought a packet. When I got home I looked up the Wy1275 and Wy1469 profiles on the Wyeast website and it said the following:
YEAST STRAIN: 1275 | Thames Valley Aleâ„¢

This strain produces classic British bitters with a rich, complex flavor profile. The yeast has a light malt character, low fruitiness, low esters and is clean and well balanced.

Origin:
Flocculation: medium-low
Attenuation: 77%
Temperature Range: 62-72° F (16-22° C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 10% ABV

Wyeast 1469 PC West Yorkshire Ale

This strain produces ales with a full chewy malt flavor and character, but finishes dry, producing famously balanced beers. Expect moderate nutty and stone-fruit esters. Best used for the production of cask-conditioned bitters, ESB and mild ales. Reliably flocculent, producing bright beer without filtration.

Attenuation 67-71%
Alc. Tolerance 9%
Flocculation high
Temperature Range 64-72°F (18-22°C)

After reading more about Wy1469 during this thread it appears that the characteristics of Wy1469 that make Dr Smurto's Landlord so good are the esters and fruity characteristics, whereas Wy1275 is low in both ester production and fruitiness. Will this mean that my brew will turn out significantly different to the one that everyone has raved about in this thread? If so, should I try brewing at 22C to try and maximise ester production? Or is there anything else anyone could recommend? Should I just be happy that it will still be a good beer, even if it is slightly different?

Cheers
Simon
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby rotten » Wednesday Feb 16, 2011 10:48 pm

IMHO, unless you can get 1469 over the next few days, be happy it will still be a good beer and get the 1469 for the next one. I recently brewed many of the Drsmurto TTL using 1469, it's worth the wait. It will still be a great beer if you can't get it, just not what you were intending.
Also I wouldn't raise the temp, and maybe don't pay too much attention to what the local LHBS guy says.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby SimonG » Friday Feb 18, 2011 7:10 pm

Thanks for the advice Rotten.

I won't have time to get a packet of 1469, so I think I'll just use the 1275 this time. I've never actually tried TTLL before but the reviews that you guys gave Dr Smuro's Landlord convinced me to give it a go, so I'm sure it will still be good (just not as good as if I used 1469). It's a good excuse to make up another batch using 1469 soon. I'll make sure that I order it ahead of time for my next one.

I made the mistake of only reading the first 6 pages of this thread before I ordered the ingredients for this recipe. If I had read the full thread (and also the Dr Smurto's Landlord thread on AHB) I wouldn't have made this choice. I have learnt that I need to do a bit more research on alternative yeasts, etc. before I order my ingredients for a new recipe and not listen too closely to the advice of the LHBS guy in future (a number of brewers on AHB have mentioned how good he is, but maybe he's just a good bloke). I actually even said to him that I neeed a yeast that produces lots of esters, so he really didn't know what he was talking about when he recommended 1275.

Cheers
Simon
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Saturday Feb 19, 2011 9:59 am

I would be fermenting this much warmer as you will still produce esters with WY1275. Not as many as with a different profile to that produced by WY1469. So push it to 20-22C.

A closer yeast to WY1469 would have been Ringwood - WY1187 and one of my favourite yeasts. I've brewed the Landlord with WY1187 before and whilst it's different to the real deal its still a very nice beer.

Just checked my records and I have used WY1275 in a Landlord before and wasn't impressed. I did only ferment it at 18C though so maybe the higher temperature will give it some help.

Taste it before bottling/kegging and if you think it is lacking a bit dry hop with more styrian goldings.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby SimonG » Sunday Feb 20, 2011 7:39 am

Thanks Doc,

I actually pitched the yeast last night and it is bubbling away nicely at 22C. This is only my 5th AG so I've still got so much more to learn about the flavours of different yeasts (i've used US05 on all my previous AG brews, which apparently has a very neutral flavour), hops, grains, etc. How would you describe the flavour of the esters that I should be looking for?

I no chill, so I french pressed (coffee plunger) 28g styrian goldings and added to the fermenter last night, as per Bribie G's suggestion. If it does need some dry hopping how much would you suggest?

Many thanks
Simon
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Sunday Feb 20, 2011 6:36 pm

I suspect the french press addition of styrian goldings will outdo the esters from WY1275 so all good.

I doubt you'll need any dry hopping but if you do then 14g (1 plug - i assume you are using plugs from the 28g addition)
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby SimonG » Monday Feb 21, 2011 8:44 pm

Does a french press addition produce much stronger aromas than the same addition at the end of the boil? I put 28g of styrian goldings pellets into the french press and added approximately 600ml of boiling water, gave it a quick stir by pushing the plunger up and down a couple of times then poured the liquid into the 24C wort.

Would you advise against doing a french press addition on my next batch using Wy1469 so that it doesn't overpower the esters? If so, is there a way that I can do an end of boil addition when I no chill? Or is this recipe not suited to no chill? Should I just add the styrian goldings at the end of the boil and chill it? I currently do an overstrength BIAB on a stove top using a 19L pot then dilute it to full volume when I put it into the fermenter. I could just put the pot into a sink of ice water to chill. (It's a lot of mucking around so I plan to buy an urn in the next few months and do a simple BIAB and bucket sparge).

Many thanks again
Simon
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Tuesday Feb 22, 2011 8:04 am

A french press will give similar results to the flameout addition. If you were to do this when using WY1469 i think you would be fine as the esters from WY1469 can be quite strong.

Not sure how to compensate for no chill. I don't do it so have not read much about it. I always encourage people to chill. It costs more for the chiller initially but if you are like me and have rainwater tanks then water usage between chill and no chill is zero. I know of others who run the water from the chiller into tanks for watering the garden or connect it to the watering system.

I feel much more comfortable knowing the yeast has been pitched within minutes of chilling.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby SuperBroo » Tuesday Feb 22, 2011 9:54 am

Which is why I am nervous about my latest brew, 1.5 days and no activity at 19 degrees.

off to LHBS today for new packet of yeast, it may have frozen at some point in the fridge :(
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby billybushcook » Friday Feb 25, 2011 11:04 am

drsmurto wrote:I feel much more comfortable knowing the yeast has been pitched within minutes of chilling.


+1 On that.

drsmurto wrote: I know of others who run the water from the chiller into tanks for watering the garden or connect it to the watering system.


I run mine into the pool, then I never have to top the pool up in between.

Mick.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby Fifey » Sunday Jul 03, 2011 11:08 am

Seriously wish 1469 was a regular. Next time it's out I want to have learned to slant.

Is this your most recent recipe? Want to try out a Landlord with maybe Ringwood, AG BIAB. Something fairly easy I can start out with.


97% Maris Otter (Thomas Fawcetts Floor Malted)
3% Weyermann Carabohemian
Fuggles @ 60 (adjust this to achieve a total of 30 IBU)1g/L EKG @ 20 mins
1g/L Styrian Goldings @ 0 mins (and not the kiwi version which is rubbish)
WY1469

Mash at 66C.

Not sure if this is the best version to date as I have made so many over the past 3 years but if it isn't it's right up there. I certainly love it and it's not going to last long at the current rate of consumption :lol:

My next attempt is to see just what the Graham Wheeler hop schedule turns out like (from How to brew your own real ale at home) - Bitter with EKG/styrian goldings and use styrian goldings 1g/L @ 10 mins.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby bullfrog » Friday Oct 14, 2011 1:10 pm

TTL fans - 1469 is in stock at CB. Just ordered me a pack which is going to be farmed heavily so I've always got some on hand!
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby squirt in the turns » Friday Oct 14, 2011 6:57 pm

bullfrog wrote:TTL fans - 1469 is in stock at CB. Just ordered me a pack which is going to be farmed heavily so I've always got some on hand!


Not any more! Man, that stuff sells out fast. I missed out again :(
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby bullfrog » Friday Oct 14, 2011 8:07 pm

Try G&G, SITT - by the looks of their website, they still had some in stock when I had a look this afternoon.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby squirt in the turns » Saturday Oct 15, 2011 5:44 pm

bullfrog wrote:Try G&G, SITT - by the looks of their website, they still had some in stock when I had a look this afternoon.


Thanks Bullfrog. I don't actually need any right now though - I've had a pack of London Ale III in the fridge for ages that I'm going to use for an ESB I'm mashing right now. I was at CB today and Anthony told me that on Tuesday they will get more 1469, and it will then be stocked as a permanent item!
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby bullfrog » Saturday Oct 15, 2011 9:37 pm

Permanent item?! Wow! So as of a week from now, my frantic scrabble to have ordered some is going to seem entirely stupid!
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby squirt in the turns » Sunday Oct 16, 2011 12:26 am

bullfrog wrote:Permanent item?! Wow! So as of a week from now, my frantic scrabble to have ordered some is going to seem entirely stupid!


They had a customer ordering 6 packs as soon as it became available. Everyone seems to go mad for this yeast. Maybe the supply will still take a while to match the demand, even if it is more readily available now.
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Re: Timothy Taylor Landlord

Postby drsmurto » Tuesday Oct 18, 2011 10:12 am

I order 2 or 3 every time is becomes available. I have made 3 Landlords from the last pack i had and given away a topcropping as well. Saved the yeastcake but have orderd another 2 packs so will ditch the cake and satrt from a fresh pack. Best yeast ever.

Another 2 places to check for Wyeast are BrewAdelaide and Beerbelly

My latest Landlord is conditioning now and will be served via a handpump at the AABC clubnight this Saturday.
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