reducing sediment

[JetFoley]

Hey, was hoping a few ppl could shed some light on some good ways to reduce sediment in the bottles?

I want to put a few brews into clear stubbys, so ppl will drink em out of the bottles and stir up any sediment in the bottom.

thnx.

Jet

[chadjaja]

Well just carbonating them in the bottle will produce sediment so it will always have some.

I've found that racking reduces it, using fining agents prior to bottling and cold crashing the beer before bottling helps a lot. Also the longer you let them sit and chucking them in the fridge for a while before drinking them rather than chilling just before consuming will produce clearer beer. Although there we are talking about the beer rather than sediment as you asked.

[Tipsy]

and cold crashing the beer before bottling helps a lot.

I agree with this, just remember to use less priming sugar though.

[billybushcook]

I agree with a day or two in the fridge just before botteling, but best left in the primary fermenter for at least a fortnight prior to any racking or cold conditioning.

Mick.

[drsmurto]

and cold crashing the beer before bottling helps a lot.

I agree with this, just remember to use less priming sugar though.

When calculating the amount of sugar used to prime you take into account the ambient temperature of the room you plan to allow the beer to carbonate in, not the initial temperature of the beer. The beer will increase in temperature until it reaches ambient. If you use the temperature of the beer at priming you will not add enough sugar to reach your desired carbonation level.

I cold condition all my beers for at least a week. Part of the reason is to reduce the amount of sediment and i add gelatine more often than not at this stage to speed the sedimentation/flocculation process up.

You don't need to rack to cold condition. Warra doesn't. I normally do.

I very rarely drink beer from a bottle that has been bottle conditioned. Coopers Ales being one of the few exceptions to the rule and normally when at a pub.

I actually prefer all beers, including Coopers ales to be clear so will pour the beer into a nice beer glass so i can admire the colour and clarity of the beer as well as the flavour and aroma.

Much easier to get the aroma of a beer from a glass than trying to stick your nose in a bottle, particularly if you have a honker the size of mine!

[Tipsy]

and cold crashing the beer before bottling helps a lot.

I agree with this, just remember to use less priming sugar though.

When calculating the amount of sugar used to prime you take into account the ambient temperature of the room you plan to allow the beer to carbonate in, not the initial temperature of the beer. The beer will increase in temperature until it reaches ambient. If you use the temperature of the beer at priming you will not add enough sugar to reach your desired carbonation level.

Hmm, back when i was bottling I was having troubles with my lagers being overcarbed. I was told it was because I was bottling them at 12c where my ales were being bottled at 20c.
I was storing my ales and lagers at the same temperature and dropping the amount of priming sugar in the lagers did fix the problem.
I was told that the beer at 12c had more disolved Co2 than the 20c ale.

I don't have any idea why this did work for me because according to the above I should probably have put more sugar in the lagers because I prefer them carbed higher.

[Bizier]

When calculating the amount of sugar used to prime you take into account the ambient temperature of the room you plan to allow the beer to carbonate in, not the initial temperature of the beer.

I disagree. I think because we are talking about a sealed vessel, a bottle, C02 will re-dissolve once you refridgerate regardless. It should effectively carbonate the same at a lower temp because you are talking simple sugars (depending on the temp tolerance of the yeast) but it should just take longer.

I think Tipsy is right and that the temperature factor in calculating priming is where you are accounting for dissolved C02 in solution in the beer at a given temperature.

[JetFoley]

so can some1 suggest a way of calculating the minimum sugar I can use to carbonate each bottle?
Sounds like crash cooling it, leaving it longer inthe fermenter and using finings will help, but the main part of the sediment is from the secondary fermentation...

[gregb]

Have a read of Palmer.

Cheers,
Greg

[drsmurto]

When calculating the amount of sugar used to prime you take into account the ambient temperature of the room you plan to allow the beer to carbonate in, not the initial temperature of the beer.

I disagree. I think because we are talking about a sealed vessel, a bottle, C02 will re-dissolve once you refridgerate regardless. It should effectively carbonate the same at a lower temp because you are talking simple sugars (depending on the temp tolerance of the yeast) but it should just take longer.

I think Tipsy is right and that the temperature factor in calculating priming is where you are accounting for dissolved C02 in solution in the beer at a given temperature.

The yeast can only produce a certain amount of CO2 depending on how much sugar you use and the temperature at which this process takes place. If you underprime because you use the temperature of the beer during the bottling process (or the temperature you intend to drink the beer at) then the yeast wont produce as much CO2 as there is less sugar for it to convert to CO2 and ethanol. Cooling the beer down to 'reabsorb' CO2 wont make a large enough difference to account for this due to the CO2 being in an equilibrium - dissolved vs headspace of the bottle.

I cold condition my beers before bottling/kegging. During the bottling/kegging process the beer will warm up, the speed of which depends on the ambient temperature of air. The first bottle may be at a similar temperature at which the beer started but i'd bet the last bottle isn't. How would you take that into account?

[Bizier]

How would you take that into account?

I let it warm back up to 18 degrees for bulk priming after chilling, and fill each bottle, but don't cap them 'til they are all done, then I cap them in roughly the same order again from the start. I calculate mine based on no significant residual C02 in solution and can hit it pretty close to what I am shooting for if I am trying to tweak a beer.

I think that the temperature variable in carbonation calculation is to do with the maximum temperature that the beer has attained during the last portion of fermentation.

There are a couple of things I have taken to doing to reduce sediment in bottles. Crash chilling, fining etc is considered standard here.
1. I rouse the beer at the end of fermentation. I find if I have not moved the beer at all, I often get yeast that has flocculated, but is hanging in suspension in little granules throughout the beer. Even if you give the fermenter a smack, they will all fall out over a day or so.
2. Siphon from the top. Just because there is a tap, you don't have to use it. You can chase the surface of the beer down and get pretty much all viable beer out. My theory is that most bacteria will fall on the surface of the fermented beer, and if you are careful, you will leave that behind undisturbed.

[Finnagann]

How badly do you want that sediment free bottle? I University some buddies and I used pressurized Co2 to carbonate, it wasn't too bad (more work than sugar, but not much) however, we used 2 Lt bottles. Doing 50-60 reg bottles would be a lot more work intensive.

I still use some 2 lt, as well as 1 lt and 450 ml swing tops, and I can't be bothered to carbonate that way... I'd rather pour it in a nice beer mug

[drsmurto]

I should have mentioned I don't bulk prime very often these days preferring to keg my beer and then bottling from the keg as i need via a counter pressure bottle filler.

Makes it easy if i am going to a mates place although if its going to be a session i just take a keg and a picnic tap.

That way i get a sediment free bottle carbonated with a little more accuracy since the calculation is simpler(CO2 pressure and temperature).

[Bigbott]

G,day all,

Ive just been reading all these post & have a question for whoever !!

I always cold chill to another 25lt vat after brewing & leave it in the fridge for another 2 weeks on around 4 deg,

My question is when i start to gas it after this amount of time should i still gas it for the 2 days or would it take less
time because of the fact that its been in the fridge cold chilling ,

I know the co2 charges quicker when the keg is cold but would it over gas ??

The reason im asking is that i was half way through gasing my latest brew IPA & i noticed that the gas was slowly
loosing presure started & 30 psi & after 1 day it had backed off to about 20 psi (my bottle is empty),
anyway i thought well ill give it a go & try one & its come out ok gas wise,

Is this because over the 2 weeks in cold chilling its started to gas itself ??



Cheers Rob.

[drsmurto]

Unless you have a source of CO2 going in to a vessel capable of holding pressure - no.

30psi? You set the reg to 30psi and leave it sit for 2 days?

What pressure are you serving at?

[Bigbott]

Ah my gauge has the two figures on it so maybe its not the psi ?? 30 = (200) on mine,

Anyway i have it set on about 8 or 10 on the gauge when pouring & its good.

[drsmurto]

8-10 psi for pouring is fine, that's what mine is set on at the moment.

If you leave the keg at this pressure it will eventually reach the right carbonation over the course of a few weeks.

If you are impatient (like me) you will use the Ross method to get it close to full carbonated. Search this site and AHB for The Ross Method for info.