Cooper's Pale Ale Can onto Kolsch Yeast Cake

[Anna]

Don't know whether to Roll On Floor Laughing or just sit here in a state of shock! Just Googled butyric acid:

"Butyric acid is found in butter, parmesan cheese, vomit, and as a product of anaerobic fermentation (including in the colon and as body odor). It has an unpleasant smell and acrid taste, with a sweetish aftertaste (similar to ether). It can be detected by mammals with good scent detection abilities (such as dogs) at 10 ppb, whereas humans can detect it in concentrations above 10 ppm."

Hmmm, yes, I see what you mean Doc! Also explains why my dog loves VB so much.

You were also spot-on about the isohops. Apparently Coopers use POR to bitter their Aussie Bitter, then top it up with iso at the packaging line.

Interesting....

[shock over - now ROFLing!)

[drsmurto]

As suggested by Hirns, the standard Coopers lager would be the pick for this, very light in colour and low in IBU (and flavour/aroma).

For a 20L batch, OG 1.048
1 x Coopers lager
1kg LDME
250g dextrose
10g Hallertauer Mittelfrueh @ 10 mins.
WY2565 Kolsch Yeast

The dex is there as you want this beer to finish dry. Should ferment down to 1.010/2 so an abv of ~4.8%.

As mentioned, the yeast is crucial.

[Anna]

Thanks Doc. What temp. range?

[drsmurto]

I8C would be a good place to start, higher will produce more esters, lower, less.

Lager for as long as you can.

This yeast doesn't flocculate very well so hit it with some gelatine to encourage it to drop out. I filter my kolschs. Will post a pic of the current one when i tap the keg.

[hirns]

Anna,

Whilst I said my neighbour (a VB drinker) liked it I was not suggesting that the beer tasted like VB. However, as posted earlier it suits the megaswill drinkers well. It is a pseudo lager with a better flavour (malt wise) than most commercial beers. I aggree with Doc on most kits probably too highly hopped, however, I will add that the Kolsch is meant to be a low hopped beer(as Doc said) and the yeast itself masks the hop profile and promotes the malt. Hence my comment earlier that I would not have guessed the CPA base.If you asked me to name a similar commercial style I would say that had it been brewed with a yeast nutrient then it would be close to Calton Dry.

To clone your VB I would go a lager yeast as suggested if it's cold enough in your parts and you could be bothered. I live in the tropics and don't have a fridge to do lagers so the Kolsch yeast is one of the many ale yeasts that can create a pseudo effect.

If I wanted to do a quick pseudo VB I would try this recipe from the morgan's site and replace the lager yeast with the Kolsch for simplity:

Can Kit Morgan’s Australian Bitter
Beer Style Victoria Bitter
Ingredients Adjuncts: 1kg Brew Cellar #10 Body Blend + 250g Dextrose
Hops: 12g Pride of Ringwood
Yeast: Premium Lager
Details: Temp: 12-18 °C
%ABV: 4.9

I've heard good things about this kit as it too is meant to be aimed at VB drinkers. I know that you're toying with extra hops etc already, but for extra simplity you could use the kit with BE II and a pseudo lager yeast.

Cheers

PS. Thinking of starting a new thread on quality yeasts strains with various kits. We all read about safale, saflager, 04 and US05 but I would like to generate some further discussion that goes beyond these staples. To get the ball rolling I'm currently doing drsmurto's Timothy Talyor's Landlord with 1469 and I'am thinking of throwing Cooper's recent English Bitter onto the yeast cake when it's finnished(I can feel others cringing with the abuse of such a great yeast)

Hirns

[hirns]

Wow! Is there a record for the longest post?

Hirns

[Anna]

Thanks for that Hirns (and thanks for not knocking...)

I plan to try the Coopers Aussie Bitter with the can of LME, as per Coopers advice - it apparently comes with an ale/lager blend yeast, so it'll be OK to brew at the moment at around 13-15 deg. C in the "brewery". Haven't tried any of the Morgans range yet, but will shortly.

[Anna]

Wow! Is there a record for the longest post?

Hirns

Dunno - but you must be close...

[hirns]

Don't know whether to Roll On Floor Laughing or just sit here in a state of shock! Just Googled butyric acid:

"Butyric acid is found in butter, parmesan cheese, vomit, and ...

... Sea Sheperd butter bombs

Hirns

[Anna]

Whathe??

[Anna]

Aha! Now I know... thanks to good ol' Google once again:

"Sea Shepherd ships pursuing illegal Japanese whaling ships in the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary have effectively used bottles of Butyric acid for five years as stink bombs on all campaigns between 2005 and 2010.

The chemical, which is simply rotten butter, is an organic biodegradable substance with a Ph of 4.82 making it less acidic than beer. We chose it because it does not pollute the marine environment and it does not cause harm to humans or other living things. It is not poison nor is it corrosive.

Butyric acid is simply fatty acid occurring in the form of esters in animal fats and plant oils. The triglyceride of butyric acid makes up 3% to 4% of butter. When butter goes rancid, butyric acid is liberated from the glyceride by hydrolysis leading to the unpleasant odor. It is an important member of the fatty acid sub-group called short-chain fatty acids. Butyric acid is a weak acid with a pKa of 4.82. The acid is an oily colorless liquid that is easily soluble in water. In other words, despite its smell it is a food grade product actually used in food additives.

But it stinks really badly. One hint is that Butyric acid is found also in vomit. Organic but not exactly appealing."

Nice to know it has another use....

[drsmurto]

Nice to know it has another use....

Other than a flavouring addition of VB