Sedex bottling caps as seen on the New inventers

[brewer bobby]

I am a new chum in the forum. I have been a grain brewer for 44 years and never done a extract beer.
The question I ask, is there any person using the SEDEX CAPS that were on the New Inventors some 12 - 18 months ago. These caps are only suitable for screw top bottles, NOT CROWN TOP.
I over the past 44 years have bottled conditioned, kegged and now because I'm retired and travel a lot have gone into the brown 740 ml plastics mainly due to the rattling of glass and breakage in the bush. Also the weight of the empty plastic bottles which I can bring home. Also the trub seems to stick better in the claw tooth on the base of the bottle.
Now here is the clanger. I purchased 150 of these so called Sedex caps and I'm far from happy with them.
Here are my reasons.
1. The valve which is spring loaded fails to open far enough to allow the trub to fall through. I also point out the fact that of 100 x 375 ml Crown stubbies that were filled I find the sediment clings to the side of the neck. The rest of the bottle is bright (clear) Because of the a fellow grain brewer who in his employment Xrays metals and I gave him 6 bottles at random out of the 100. He Xrayed them and all have the valve leaning over to on side of the cap which I now consider the reason why the trub is not falling through to the catcher below.I have every second day swirled the stubbies to get it to fall through but to no avail. This swirling has been going on for near on 3 weeks. I'm Peeeeeed off. I gave my mate who done the Xrays 6 of these Sedex caps also and he has the same problem of the valve leaning over to one side which again I stress fails to allow the trub to fall through freely.
2. I also find the bottles are top heavy for the base and when put into plastic crates you pull one out to swirl and the rest if not careful will fall over.
3. I have arthritis in my hands and I find it virtually impossible to unscrew the catcher from the cap when putting the two parts together when bottling. I don't have a problem with separating the catcher from the cap when the beer is ready to drink not that I have drank one yet. I CAN'T GET THE FINAL PART OF THE TRUB THROUGH TO THE CATCHER. I have tried many prototypes of ways to screw the both together and unscrew. The 6 little lugs on the cap ( 3 on each side ) part of the Sedex are not pronounced enough to grip and I find this a bad design.
4. After the purchase of these I now learn that you may have to use a food grade silicon spray to help separate the cap from the silicon seal in the catcher if both parts are hard to put together. My belief is there should be NO spray as it may induce an off taste or infect the beer.
5. Now for the sterilising of the Sedex caps and catcher. I'm instructed that they are to be washed in cold water and DO NOT use hot water. In my 44 years of brewing HOT water is the go. Also the two O rings that are in the cap part of the Sedex one to seal the bottle and the other to seal the cap when the catcher is removed after the trub has cleared. I cannot remove the two O rings to sterilise behind them. The silicon seal is VERY HARD to remove for cleaning. To me they MUST be removed to sterilise properly.
6. There are other faults with this Sedex system that I won't go into at this stage but all I can say is I parted with just on 600 bucks and I should have known better after 44 years of good brewing, IF IT AIN'T BROKE DON'T FIX IT.
Finally before I sign off, I inform you that grow my own hops each year, I malt my own barley and other grain and propagate my own yeast.
Cheers and I hope this can be of benefit to other brewers. I don't run other products down but I think this Sedex cap system may be OK for Extract brewing but not grain. By the way I gave 10 of these caps to 3 other grain brewers friends and all find the same problems with the trub not settling through the valve in the cap closer.

[earle]

Hi Bobby

Its interesting to hear you experience with these and well done for starting a new thread, I think you original post got a bit lost tagged onto the other thread.

Have you contacted the manufacturer with your feedback, I wonder if they have a satisfaction money-back type guarantee?

Also, I'm interested in why you think they might be suitable for extract beers but not grain. Its yeast we're talking about after all isn't it?

Cheers
Earle

[Bum]

I was wondering the same thing when I read the original post too, earle.

Brewer bobby, how long do you leave your beers in the fermenter prior to bottling? Perhaps you could see better results with more clearing time before they hit the bottle? I bottle exclusively and have to say I didn't see a noticable difference in the amount of trub in the bottles when I switched from kits to AG.

I'm not personally familiar with these caps but surely this swirling you're doing is unsettling whatever sediment you already have? And wouldn't the valve only be working when you take the sediment catcher off? So these valves being to the side when the two pieces are together would actually be how the design works, wouldn't it?

[brewer bobby]

I will try and answer the 2 posts.
No I have not got in touch with the inventor who I purchased them from. I thought I would seek other brewers opinions first and that way if they found problems as I am encountering, then I will get back to them, the inventor that is.
I only brew Ales and my fermentation is done in a 6 x 4 foot room which is 6inch thick insulated walls etc. and is kept at exactly 20 degrees all year round. It costs nothing to run, all solar heating and cooling.
After fermentation is finished I transfer the fermenter/s into the fridge and drop it to approx 3 degrees for a week or so till it's bright ( Till I can read a book through the ale.) If it's not bright it ain't getting bottled or kegged.
I know of many extract brewers who do the kit beers and I have given 6 of these SEDEX caps/catchers and the trub is fine in theirs and there in no clinging to the wall of the bottle.
When I purchased these things The instructions say the if the trub ( Sediment ) sticks to the sides simply swirl the bottle to dislodge it. They suggest CROWN stubbies as there are no shoulders on the bottle where the trub can sit. I know in my mind what the problem is. The hole that the trub slips through is a mere 2-3 ml and that ain't enough.
There is a web site where a Yank in USA demonstrates it. I only found it by mistake and it's very interesting. I an old fellow and when it comes to pushing computer keys I can end up anywhere.
If you type in (((((((((((sedex plastic bottle tops))))))))))))) you should find what I'm on about.
Again I'm not happy at this stage and in the next hour I am meeting up with the others who I gave 6 to try and we will compare the beers and look at our next move.
Between us all have been brewing only grain beer for over 27 yrs. I'm the old fella who started back in 1963 when I married and had to save dough to buy the house and have not stopped since.
Here is one for you. The last time I purchased a commercial beer was over 10 yrs ago.
Chow 4 now. Take care.

[earle]

Given that you crash cool I'm surprised that they seem to work better for your "kit" friends than they do for you. I wonder if the difference is due to type of yeast or some other procedural factor rather than the extract/grain difference you have identified. I would carefully question them and compare that to your situation.

Out of interest where are you, your posts show quite a time-zone difference?

Cheers

[Bum]

Bugger. Sorry my questions ended up being pretty irrelevant.

In terms of opinions from other brewerswho've used them I've heard mostly positive feedback - but this is from a very small number of people. It is a real shame they aren't working out for you.

Perhaps you should just shoot them off a polite email with your concerns about your results and see what they have to say.

[speedie]

AFTER 44 YEARS OF BREWIN WHY DID YOU GO FOR WHIZZY BOTTLE CAPS

[Bum]

Ignore him, brewer bobbie.

As best you can, anyway.

[speedie]

bobby just do it
love ya bum on both sites you are a champ

[brewer bobby]

Am in West Aussie.
Have rectified the problem by putting a 5mm ball bearing to allow the valve to rise more.
We opened 9 stubbies last night all different eg. 1 crown, 1 mid strength 1 hahn or whatever one calls it. Three different brewers all grain. All when opened all had a thick layer of trub around the O ring which allows the trub to enter the catcher ( which is the base of the invention.) The beer then became CLOUDY. Gee I'm Peeeeed off.
I will now advise the person/s who I purchased them from of the problem.
If someone out there has some of these, simply put one together and u will see what I'm on about in when the valve in lifted by the small post in the catcher u will see the valve and O ring fall over to one side of the wall on the cap and then take note of how much room there is for the trub to fall through.
Now the problem is to find several hundred of the 5 mm bearings as sure as sure I will lose some over time. The post in the catcher which raises the valve is too short.
The reason I bought the things is brewing is my passion and will always be till I get badly burnt in the crematorium. I love trying new things when it comes to beer. Not many times are my fingers burnt but this time they are singed badly. My Missus told me right from the start, ( Bobby, just by 30 and try them) I should have listened to her. Cheers for now, It's beer o'clock here in the west. 4-30pm and I will salute the first beauty.

[hirns]

Speedie?

[speedie]

bobby go for it i am west aussie (east freo)
i have just come back from my shed after bottling 200 litre sof wizeni used plain old crown seals to cap a batch
hirns?

[brewer bobby]

Problem all fixed now by simply placing a small pure brass washer into the groove of the cap and then screwing the catcher on and it lifts the valve straight whereas with the ball bearing the valve still fell sideways against the wall. I have posted this should any other brewer out there be having the same problem as I have. I have sent a message to the inventors advising them of my problem. To correct the problem by them is simple, increase the lenght of the plastic stem in the catcher by a mere 1/8th.

[brewer bobby]

Fellow brewers. Remember me with the Sedex plastic catchers.
Here is the final result of my and three (3) other close brewers mates, 2 grain and one extract brewer.
A brew was done by each of us and half were bottled normally with crown caps and the other half were with the Sedex plastic catchers.
All bottles were carbonated with the same Castor sugar and all bottles were put together and held at 20 degrees in my carbonation room for 28 days to mature.
The only difference in the beers was each of us used different recipes.
All the stubbies used were the same brand.
The result is half the bottles that were crown sealed were beer fit for a king and the other half beers done with the Sedex plastic catchers were fit for the drain in the sink. That's where they ended.
All beers done with the Sedex system had a taint taste of PLASTIC in the beer.
I must point out all brewers have been brewing for over 20 years each and we know our brewing back to front and each brewer sterilised the plastic catchers with different types of sterilizer.
All brewers done their beers at their premises and each were given 30 catchers by me to see the end result.
The end result is all 150 complete catchers and the extra 150 plastic caps that I purchased have been disposed of in the recycling bin.
As I have stated before. I should have listened to my better half and only ordered only 30 to try.
I will put the near on $600-00 including freight wasted on the purchase down to dumbness.
I have emailed the company where I purchased them some weeks ago and to date I have not had a reply.
Other brewers may have better results with the catchers.
Before I end I will advise you fellow brewers that I purchased a THERMINATOR from the US of A at one third of the price they are selling here in Aust and it is brilliant.
I highly recommend it to any brewer.

regards.

[Oliver]

Hi BB,

Feel free to post the email to the company here if you feel it would be appropriate.

Oliver