Lager - bottle conditioned

[AidanMatthews]

Hey guys,

When you lager a beer in a secondary for 3-6 weeks before bottling is that process taking all the yeast to the bottom so much so that very little of tha yeas goes into the bottle when bottle conditioning.

Will i have trouble getting good carbonation?

Should i look at priming with fresh wort and small ale yeast mix?

Or should the normal prime with dex be ok but take longer to carb?

[drsmurto]

There will always be enough yeast to carbonate your beer.

Stick to dex.

I find that extended lagering does increase the time it takes to carbonate, from 7 days to 14+ days.

[warra48]

I endorse DrSmurto's comments.

I've had to wait as long as 6 to 8 weeks for satisfactory carbonation in some of my lagers, but that was after lagering for almost 3 months.
Having said that, they've always got there eventually.

[AidanMatthews]

Thanks guys,

First ag is going to be a nice crisp clean pilsner

[bullfrog]

Ooft! Bold move for a first attempt at AG. My hat goes off to you, sir. The problem with lagers (besides that I find them bland) is that there isn't a huge margin for error; when you're going for that "crisp clean" finish, any faults in your process or recipe don't have a lot to hide behind. At least with a big, full-on ale there's a lot of hops and decent malt profile to cover up any accidents or learning curves.

Good luck with your first go around on AG. Once you've come to the dark side, you won't look back!

[AidanMatthews]

When i make a bad beer im so stubborn not to waste any i drink my way through my mistakes,
Every sip that i think, "man that tastes horrible" it just gives an opportunity to think of ways not to make a beer tha tastes tha bad ever again hahahahah.


As for the divin into the deep end with a pilsner, i like a challenge and learnt heaps of you guys already so its almost like some mistakes have been ironed out already through the forum.

[billybushcook]

Aidan, go for it!
That's the same thing I did, not nescessarily a Pilsner but still that crisp, clean, Blonde style.

ivé been regularily re-doing the same recipe since I started AG nearly 2yrs ago because I like it, had some really nice ones, both with Ale & Lager yeast & had some more average ones but never a bad one.

Ivé been using
4Kg Pale Pils Malt
0.5Kg Wheat Malt
0.5Kg Flaked Maize

IBU - around 28, some times single addition but most times with an aroma addition as well.
This is more of a Blonde recipe, a Pilsner might want a little more IBU with emphasis on Hop flavour & aroma.

I some times play with adding a little Crystal & or Munich & drop the Maize for a bit of colour & body but then you want more Hops to balance it too.

Cheers, Mick.

[drsmurto]

Was drinking a pilsner last night that had been lagered for 4+ weeks and polyclared.

3 weeks after bottle priming it's perfectly carbonated (and tasting very nice).

[speedie]

when so called lagering is undertaken it is an extended period of cold settling
if one was to remove the product from this enviroment add fresh yeast and dex and leave at room temperature it would self carbonate in a matter of days
then put it back into cold storage for serving purposes and bingo bubbles
in main stream production of commercial pils etc it would be in line or pinpoint carbonated
speed

[bullfrog]

The point is, Speedie, that unless you centrifuge to remove yeast and sediment, like the big breweries do, you have no need to add extra yeast at all. Extra time in the bottle may be needed, but you're making a lager after all, so there's no expectation that it will be ready to drink soon.

Oh, and no, "lager" doesn't imply a cold environment. It tends to do best if it is done at a cold temperature, but "lager" just means to leave alone for a while. I know a few people who brew lagers regularly and do their lagering at room temperature.

[speedie]

jerri the term lager is of german origin and referred to cave storing beer
this was a cold consant temperature away from the freezing outside temps
so if you concider storing beer at anything above 5 degrees you are going to reduce the life of the beer
point if we live in darwin i think that storing (lagering) under your house wouldnt be very practical

primary fermentation is the first process ie when all of the convertable sugar is metabilised by yeast and ferment stops
secondary is when more fermentables are introduced into solution
third etc

bottle conditioning is reintroducing fermentables and would be concidered a stage in fermentation process
cheers speedo

[AidanMatthews]

Was drinking a pilsner last night that had been lagered for 4+ weeks and polyclared.

3 weeks after bottle priming it's perfectly carbonated (and tasting very nice).

Can i assume doc that you lagered for 4 weeks and then polyclared a day or 2 before bottling?

[drsmurto]

Normally like to add the polyclar a week before bottling just to make sure it settles in a nice tight cake on the bottom of the cube/jerry.

[SuperBroo]

Howdy Doc,
Sorry if its a bit off topic...
Did you filter after leaving the polyclar to settle for a week ?
Do you always filter after polyclar ?

Cheers,
Chris

[drsmurto]

Very rarely filter these days and no, the current pilsner wasn't filtered.

I polyclar beers that i know will be served colder than i would normally. If it goes into a keg my fridge is set to 7-8C so above the temp chill haze occurs.

This pils was for a case swap and no doubt people will be serving it cold so i added polyclar this time.

Filtering is a final polish. Beer should be clear prior to filtering otherwise you are asking too much of your filter.