Newbie question - planning my second batch

[afromaiko]

If I wanted to make Hoegaarden with a liquid yeast instead would the Wyeast Labs Belgian Witbier 3944 be the best choice? I heard the K97 wasn't actually that great.

[Adzmax]

Yup, 3944 is what I'll be using for my next batch

Check this site out, kinda handy!

http://www.wyeastlab.com/beprlist.htm

[Danzar]

Well, have finally given this one a thorough go. Sensational. The torrefied wheat has definitely given it the creamy mouthfeel and has offset the loss of head you get with the orange peel.

I was kicking myself for over boiling the orange but the strong orange aftertaste is dissipating. This is a great beer.

I have a second batch that's been in the bottle for a week now. I boiled the orange for only 10 minutes this time - will be even better.

Great recipe.

A question - how do the makers of Hoeeggarden remove the colour? It's practically clear...

[Adzmax]

I've been doing a lot of reading but I'm pretty new so don't quote me here but I'd be guessing they use a faily light malt. When doing your boil perhaps dont' add the LDM at the start of the boil as I beleive this tends to darken the colour.

Next time I'm going to do my boil only with the Wheat malt extract, organge peel and corriander then add the LDM for the last couple of mins.

I wait to be corrected though

[afromaiko]

Danzar, could you please post the latest version of your recipe? I'm keen to make this one.

thanks.

[Danzar]

Danzar, could you please post the latest version of your recipe? I'm keen to make this one.

thanks.

Not my recipe - credit goes to pixelboy and lethaldog, plus NTRabbit for the torrefied wheat suggestion. Have made a few adjustments, some based on the replies here and some based on experience with the first batch.

INGREDIENTS
1. 1 can of Coopers Brewmaster selection Wheat Beer (or the Blackrock Whispering wheat)
2. 1.5kg (can) of liquid wheat malt (lethal suggests 1.5kg of dried wheat malt - take your pick).
3. 15g coriander seeds - crushed. They are dry - you want to crack most of the seeds so the flavour seeps in on the boil.
4. Rind from 2 oranges - pixelboy made the point to avoid the white part (pith) - just rind.
5. 500g torrefied wheat.
6. K97 Safaele yeast.
7. Saaz hops (my suggestion)

BREWING INSTRUCTIONS
1. Steep your torrefied wheat in 3 litres of freshly boiled water.
2. While it's steeping, throw 2 litres water and your crushed seeds into a pot and boil for 10 minutes. At the 10 minute mark, add the malt and orange rind (I'm going off Adzmax's suggestion to boil the malt for less time). Continue boiling for 5 more minutes. Remove from heat and let stand for 15 minutes.
3. Strain the liquid from the steeped wheat into a smaller pot and boil this liquid for a few minutes - just to kill any nasties.
4. Strain the liquid from the boiled fermentables into your fermenter.
5. Add the boiled liquid from torrefied wheat to the fermenter.
6. Leave this for now and steep or boil your Saaz in water (boiled) for 15 minutes.
7. While it's steeping/boiling, get back to your fermenter and top up with COLD (I refrigerate as much water as I can the night before as your wort will be pretty hot at this point and needs cooling, particularly in summer).
8. Add the hops and liquid.
9. Take your SG reading.
10. Add the yeast. Ideal pitch temp is around 22 degrees max.

PRESTO!

NOTES:
The K97 is pretty active, so I suggest you leave the slightest of gaps when you put the lid on the fermenter, just for the first two days. Otherwise your airlock will vomit krausen.

Don't boil the orange for too long. I originally boiled for a full 15 minutes and it's too strong. 5 minutes should be fine.

The torrefied wheat sucks up alot of liquid, hence I've increased the steep amount to 3 litres.

Hops are purely optional.

[Adzmax]

Ahhh you've inspired me, I'm gonna give this another go now. I'll put one on over the weekend. I'm going to use Wyeast 3944 though.

3944 Belgian Witbier Yeast.
Probable origin: Hoegaarden, Belgium
Beer Styles: White Beer, Grand Cru, Doubles, Spiced beers
Commercial examples may include: Celis Wit, Hoegaarden, Blanc de Brugge

[Danzar]

Oops - forgot about that one. I'm going to include same in my next one.

[afromaiko]

Excellent info, thanks heaps! I picked up a can of the Black Rock Whispering Wheat today, and will grab the rest of the ingredients shortly. Should be very tasty!

[timmy]

After making this one and leaving it for a while, I think it definately needs some more body (which the torrified wheat should offer). I drank my 2 month old drop at the weekend and it was a bit like making love on the beach.

The next attempt will be using the Whispering Wheat recipe.

Sort of OT, but how does the Cascade Spicy Ghost rate compared to the Coopers Wheat kit?

Cheers,

Tim

[pixelboy]

Good stuff Danzar...

It does indeed look like an improvement to my original recipe. After tasting mine again I couldnt agree more about the SAAZ!

Thats why I love this forum.. help from everyone..

We should call this brew the "Home Brew and Beer Summer Wheat".

[lethaldog]

Good stuff Danzar...

It does indeed look like an improvement to my original recipe. After tasting mine again I couldnt agree more about the SAAZ!

Thats why I love this forum.. help from everyone..

We should call this brew the "Home Brew and Beer Summer Wheat".

Strapping idea me boy
Like you said, this is the point of this place, we can take a little bit from everyone..

We all have different tastes but at the end of the day all the genuine posters here just want to make yours and thier beer the best it can be

[Danzar]

Thanks guys!

I'm drinking the first bottle from that batch now. The orange has definitely come out so that you taste it, but it doesn't linger for too long.

I made a point of hitting my usual lunch haunt and chugging down a few Hoegaardens.

This is so close as to not be funny.

A few points then recommendations on getting this bang on:
1. On that orange taste' - the Hoegaarden 'orange' taste is just a hint. Plus, it doesn't have that 'raw' orange taste, it's just a flavour.
REC: I'd skip boiling the orange and actually toss it into the boiled fermetables and leave it to stand for the 15 minutes. This should give you a different style of orange flavour (plus better head) due to the drop in oil levels.
2. On coriander - I'd drop this to 10-12g, not 15g, just to keep the balance. The Hoegaarden does not have a very strong coriander taste to it.
3. On taste in general - I think this needs a slightly more robust wheat beer concentrate than the Coopers. Do you think the Blackrock holds the answer?

Just some thoughts. Welcome any ideas.

[Adzmax]

I was at the Belgium Beer Garden on the weekend and had a couple too and I'd have to agree.

It's a very subtle taste, I think you can almost taste more coriander than organe but that might just be me.

I've been steeping 1kg of grain in my recent Heffe Weizen's and I've found that are are MUCH smoother. As soon as my current batch is done I'll pop on another one of these and give that a go. This might add to the beer too.

I've recently used the Morgans Extracts so I'll see how they go, anyone else had any experience with them?

One note is that they actualy use dried organe rind to make Hoegaarden, or so I've read.

[Danzar]

I was at the Belgium Beer Garden on the weekend and had a couple too and I'd have to agree.

It's a very subtle taste, I think you can almost taste more coriander than organe but that might just be me.

I've been steeping 1kg of grain in my recent Heffe Weizen's and I've found that are are MUCH smoother. As soon as my current batch is done I'll pop on another one of these and give that a go. This might add to the beer too.

I've recently used the Morgans Extracts so I'll see how they go, anyone else had any experience with them?

One note is that they actualy use dried organe rind to make Hoegaarden, or so I've read.

That's interesting beacuse I think the orange taste in the clone is too fresh.

Here's another view - I disturbed the sediment at the bottom and felt that mixing the sediment (provided there's not too much on the bottom) glues it all together and gives it a richer flavour.

So, I'm going to try the Blackrock, with the 3944 Belgian Witbier Yeast you suggested, add dried orange rind and will up the torrefied wheat to a kg.

Stay tuned.

[pixelboy]

Nice one Danzar,

Hey I notice your in my neck of the woods, we should get together one day and compare brews

My BBQ is always itch'n to be lit

Maybe one day over the XMAS break?

[Danzar]

Nice one Danzar,

Hey I notice your in my neck of the woods, we should get together one day and compare brews

My BBQ is always itch'n to be lit

Maybe one day over the XMAS break?

Sounds like a plan.

I also have regular 'beer-a-thons' at home, when my stocks get a little high.

Here's my home email. Drop my a line.

rochellendaniel@iinet.net.au

[Danzar]

Here you go peoples.

Use this:

Bitter Orange Peel (Curacau)

Used to spice Belgian style beers, especially Witbiers (Hoegaarden) . Also called Curacao Orange Peel, these green-gray peels are one of the most popular specialty herbs on the market.

Suggested 'dose' is 14g per batch.

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[Adzmax]

Thats the one!!!!

[afromaiko]

Here you go peoples.

Use this:

Bitter Orange Peel (Curacau)

Used to spice Belgian style beers, especially Witbiers (Hoegaarden) . Also called Curacao Orange Peel, these green-gray peels are one of the most popular specialty herbs on the market.

Suggested 'dose' is 14g per batch.

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Where might one find this exotic sounding peel? Is it available from health food shops?

Also, are you still going with the Saaz hops? How much do you recommend using?

thanks!