Avoiding HB flavour from Kit Hops?
One would assume that the dehydrating process used to make extracts is 'the' difference.
Like a previous poster said-
TV dinner versus freshly cooked dinner using fresh materials.
AG is 'potentially' a better option than extract brewing but care and significant skill and extra equipment (read a lot of extra equipment) is required to pull it off.
A carefully assembled kit brew, fermented at the right temp with high quality yeast makes bloody good beer, particularly the styles that lend themselves to extract brewing.
It doesn't take more than an hour either.
My AG brew days are 5-7 hour ordeals.
A high degree of satisfaction is gained though taking a bag of grain and turning it into something quite stunning to drink.
Personally I am only doing kits at the moment due to a complete lack of time and through careful selection of the parts of the process I can control am getting excellent results.
Its all good and AG is definitely something anyone who calls themselves a brewer needs to try. Most won't go back!
Andrew.
Like a previous poster said-
TV dinner versus freshly cooked dinner using fresh materials.
AG is 'potentially' a better option than extract brewing but care and significant skill and extra equipment (read a lot of extra equipment) is required to pull it off.
A carefully assembled kit brew, fermented at the right temp with high quality yeast makes bloody good beer, particularly the styles that lend themselves to extract brewing.
It doesn't take more than an hour either.
My AG brew days are 5-7 hour ordeals.
A high degree of satisfaction is gained though taking a bag of grain and turning it into something quite stunning to drink.
Personally I am only doing kits at the moment due to a complete lack of time and through careful selection of the parts of the process I can control am getting excellent results.
Its all good and AG is definitely something anyone who calls themselves a brewer needs to try. Most won't go back!
Andrew.
Chris wrote:I think that if you can't get a malt extract brew to taste as good, if not better than an AG beer, then you might need to consider your process and ingredients.
I'd drink a ME beer over VB- an AG beer, any day!
I don`t understand that. If malt extract brews are as good, if not better than all grain brews, why are people spending hundreds of dollars on equipment and 6-8 hours to make all grain? Are you saying they are being misled and don`t realise it?
What you put in is what you get out - I think that sums up most things and this includes homebrewing.
As an avid home chef, i love using fresh ingredients, herbs etc - bottled sauces, packet mixes etc just cant compete with the flavours you get using the best and freshest ingredients possible. The same should be true with beer.
Never done AG or even extract but i would think that starting from the grain and extracting the 'goodness' yourself has to be better. I hope so cos its what i am working up to.
Thats my 2 cents.
Cheers
DrSmurto
As an avid home chef, i love using fresh ingredients, herbs etc - bottled sauces, packet mixes etc just cant compete with the flavours you get using the best and freshest ingredients possible. The same should be true with beer.
Never done AG or even extract but i would think that starting from the grain and extracting the 'goodness' yourself has to be better. I hope so cos its what i am working up to.
Thats my 2 cents.
Cheers
DrSmurto
I think what chris is trying to say is that isn't just the proccess that leads to the quality of the beer. using chris' example, VB is technically an AG, but i would rather drink any of my k&k's over VB. You can get some amazing AG's, but not all AG beat all K&K's, there are many other contributing factors.ryan wrote:Chris wrote:I think that if you can't get a malt extract brew to taste as good, if not better than an AG beer, then you might need to consider your process and ingredients.
I'd drink a ME beer over VB- an AG beer, any day!
I don`t understand that. If malt extract brews are as good, if not better than all grain brews, why are people spending hundreds of dollars on equipment and 6-8 hours to make all grain? Are you saying they are being misled and don`t realise it?
Keep it reel 
gecko,
By all means continue with kit brewing and add whatever you want, control the temp ect...... You will impress yourself and a few mates along the way.
You will say to yourself thats a nice beer, I made that and god its good ( I think most of us have because I know I have) and the best part is it didn't cost you an arm and leg like the bottle shop.
Now the next thing you and other new brewers should do is by any means either through a brew club ( join one) or in your case gecko, post your location and maybe get an invite to an AG brew day as I have.
If this person has the slightest clue to what he is doing upon your first taste of AG you will say to yourself holy shite, god this is great, WOW,
hope he offers me another one !, and why am I doing kits ?
Chris - good one, I would rather drink straight turps than VB any day, but we are talking about home brew.
drsmurto - home chef?!! I will supply the beer if you supply the food !!
By all means continue with kit brewing and add whatever you want, control the temp ect...... You will impress yourself and a few mates along the way.
You will say to yourself thats a nice beer, I made that and god its good ( I think most of us have because I know I have) and the best part is it didn't cost you an arm and leg like the bottle shop.
Now the next thing you and other new brewers should do is by any means either through a brew club ( join one) or in your case gecko, post your location and maybe get an invite to an AG brew day as I have.
If this person has the slightest clue to what he is doing upon your first taste of AG you will say to yourself holy shite, god this is great, WOW,
hope he offers me another one !, and why am I doing kits ?
Chris - good one, I would rather drink straight turps than VB any day, but we are talking about home brew.
drsmurto - home chef?!! I will supply the beer if you supply the food !!
Last edited by Schooner on Wednesday Dec 27, 2006 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I tend to agree with Schooner & Ed on this one. Sure you can make a great extract beer but I feel AG does slightly have the edge over extract.Chris wrote:I think that if you can't get a malt extract brew to taste as good, if not better than an AG beer, then you might need to consider your process and ingredients.
I'd drink a ME beer over VB- an AG beer, any day!
There's the flaw Chris. How do you truely know how old your extract is?
I have experienced the extract 'twang' & it's not pleasant at all.
Have you ever taken a piece of de-hydrated apple & re-hydrated it & compared the taste to a fresh apple?
Another aspect of AG that I love is the whole world of new flavours when it comes to different base malts. I doubt I could replicate the great flavour of using base grains like Golden Promise or Maris Otter in an English Bitter with extract.
Would you really class VB as AG with the amount of sugar they use in it? & FWIW I'd choose a well made K&K over VB any day. No real comparison there.
Last edited by chris. on Monday Oct 08, 2007 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mythbusting is the correct term ryanryan wrote:Chris wrote:I think that if you can't get a malt extract brew to taste as good, if not better than an AG beer, then you might need to consider your process and ingredients.
I'd drink a ME beer over VB- an AG beer, any day!
I don`t understand that. If malt extract brews are as good, if not better than all grain brews, why are people spending hundreds of dollars on equipment and 6-8 hours to make all grain? Are you saying they are being misled and don`t realise it?
...I'll put my spoon away now
Last edited by chris. on Monday Oct 08, 2007 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I'm pretty flat out at the moment and can't see it stopping any time soon. AG brewing from what I understand takes about 5hrs out of a day to get it right. I reckon the most I'd get into is maybe partial. The HBS will be the go for the future for sure. Coles has lost my business for a while until they do have good extracts on the shelf that aren't out of date. 
Cheers
Cheers
111222333 pretty much summed up what I meant.
"Sure you can make a great extract beer but I feel AG does slightly have the edge over extract."
I do agree with this statement, I was just going to bat for the rarely-defended ME brews.
I was just making the point that ME brews can in some cases be better that AG, not that they necessarily ARE better.
"Sure you can make a great extract beer but I feel AG does slightly have the edge over extract."
I do agree with this statement, I was just going to bat for the rarely-defended ME brews.
I was just making the point that ME brews can in some cases be better that AG, not that they necessarily ARE better.