New Lemonade

[Trizza]

I'm going to put this brew down in a few weeks, but I though I'd pass it by you guys first to see what you think.

Brew 17 - Lemonade

2 Kg Lemons
1 Kg Limes
3 Kg Dextrose
2 Kg Lactose
500g Yellowbox Honey
10g Sweet Dried Orange Peel @ 20 mins
10g Sweet Dried Orange Peel @ 10 mins
10g Yeast Nutrient
Lavin EC-1118 Champagne Yeast
Filled to 23L

I'm not sure how long I should boil the Lemons/Limes for, any ideas?

What do you guys think of this new recipe with the addition of limes and orange peel?
Does anyone have an idea how long a brew like this would ferment for?
Is there anything else that I could add to this already unorthodox brew to make it any better?

[Oliver]

I can't comment with authority on any aspect of this recipe.

However, 1kg of limes is a lot of limes. Apart from being expensive, unless you have some good cheap source of limes, I reckon that may be too much lime, and may result in a lemonade that's too limey.

Maybe do 250g first up, then add more next time if you feel it's warranted.

Thoughts anyone?

Oliver

[erik]

Hey Triz,

Have you used Champagne yeast before???

I've only done 2 Lemons - then again only done 24 brews - so faily new to this.

No1. 3Kg Lemons (boiled for an hour with all the zest included), 1kg Dex, 1kg LActose, 2 X Champagne yeast - result - not real good, it would turn my face inside-out with every sip.

No2. #kg Lemons (sliced and boiled for an hour then strained), 3kg Dex, 2kg Dex - Safale yeast - much better - the only diff is more Lactose, no zest and Safale yeast - I think Champ yeast is very very very dry - have tried it with an 11% GInger Beer as well - not real good.

Too Many Bocks tonight..... let us know how you go - I'd suggest using Salale yeast rather than the Champ.

I have found that lemons (probably any fruit) is an unknown fermatble factor - beware.


Enjoy

E

[Trizza]

Erik,

I've never used the Champagne yeast before, so I'm not sure what the results are going to be. i believe that lactose is the key from keeping the brew from becoming too dry, so provided that i have sufficient quantities of it, my brew will end up fine, even if I use the yeast. I will add more Lactose at the end of fermentation if more sweetness is required.

Also I've already purchased the Champagne yeast, and its a long way to G&G to go and get safale, might use it in the next brew.

Is there anything else i could add to potentially add more body to this brew?

When you mentioned the zest, what do you mean, are you referring to the white stuff or something else?

Oliver,

I'm going to use only 500g of limes and 2.5kg of Lemons, which should give a twang to the lemonade, which would be unique and interesting.

Does anyone have an idea of how long a fermentation of this nature using champange yeast would take?

Any other suggestions on this brew?

[Chris]

Just a bit of advice, unless you like it really dry, try using a white wine yeast instead of a champagne- it breaks the fruit down nicely, but keeps some of a residual sweetness.

1kg of limes! Go for it! I'm planning a lime-ade when the next crop of my GF parents comes in.

Zest is the yellow stuff. The white stuff is good to avoid if possible, but is no real problem.

I just chop the fruit up really finely- as fine as you can be stuffed doing after 3kgs worth, then HEAT (not boil) for about 20-30mins in a pot with a little water. Keep your temp around 70*C. Try to avoid going above 76*C, as that's the pectin release temp.

As far as time, expect 2 weeks minimum.

[KEG]

the pith (white stuff) can impart a nasty bitter taste... best to go with the fruit flesh and the zest only IMO. i made a ginger beer a while ago, and chopped up lemons whole and added em in late in the boil. tasted very strongly of the pith, and that was only 2 lemons over ~20 litres.

[erik]

Maybe it was boiling the lemons that made my brew so bitter??? so much to learn - so little brews.

[Trizza]

Does anyone think that using Maltodextrin in a Lemonade, would go down well, adding some extra body to the brew, which would otherwise be quite light in body?

[Chris]

Use LDM. It works nicely.

[Oliver]

To zest a lemon or lime, you just grab a fine grater (or a special lemon zester, if you really like) and grate off the outer coloured layer.

As is said above, don't go too deep as you'll be grating off pith, which is very bitter.

Cheers,

Oliver

[Trizza]

I'm going to be making this next week....

2.5 Kg Lemons - Zest and Flesh, no pith or seeds
500 g Limes - Zest and Flesh, no pith or seeds
3 Kg Dextrose
1.5 Kg Lactose (more to be added at racking if required)
500g Yellowbox Honey
500g Maltodextrin
40% of Lemon/Lime Zest @ 60 mins
30% of Lemon/Lime Zest @ 30 mins
30% of Lemon/Lime Zest @ 10 mins
10g Sweet Dried Orange Peel @ 20 mins
10g Sweet Dried Orange Peel @ 10 mins
Lemon/Lime Flesh/Juice @ 20 mins (Heated, not Boiled - Separate Pot)
10g Yeast Nutrient
Safale S-04 Ale Yeast, or
Lavin QA23 Wine Yeast, or
Lavin EC-1118 Champagne Yeast

And now the explanation...

I'm going to have all the yeasts on hand if the fermentation does not commence. I'll start with the Safale, if that doesnt work i'll try the wine yeast, and if that doesn't work I have the Champagne yeast.

I decided to boil the Zest to gain some of the oils similar to that you get from boiling hops, i pulled the times and percentages out of thin air, and if anyone has ideas about improving bitterness, flavour and aroma ratio let me know

I'm hoping that the removal of the pith and seeds will prevent some of the bitterness, but I do want some of the flavour, which is why I've chosen to add 40% at 60 mins. I'm not sure if this will create lemonade too bitter, any thoughts?

I'm using maltodextrin to hopefully add some body. Chris suggested using LDM, but I haven't seen a recipe on this website that has used LDM in the past, so I'm going to avoid it.

Any other suggestions?

Trizza

[yardglass]

Triz,
Looks pretty good, how long are you boiling for though ?
Add the honey late in the boil, only other thing I can think of is maybe a Brown Sugar addition of 250/500gm at the same time as the honey.
Cheers
Yard

[Trizza]

I'll be boiling the Lemon/Lime Zest for the times specified next to the percentages (as you would for boiling, flavor and aroma hops). I'd reasoned that boiling them for intervals of 60, 30, and 10 mins would create an effect similar to that of boiling hops, and allow a wide range of oils to be evolved. I'll be straining this on entry into primary.

I'm not sure that I should have 40% of the Zest on for 60 minutes , as this may create too many bitter characteristics. My personal preference is to have very strong flavored lemonade, so this might be the way to go.

The same goes for the Orange Peel (leftover from wheat beer) as I'll be adding it to the boil at the times listed.

I'm going to blend the flesh into a pulp then heat it for 20 mins around 70 degrees. When adding it to primary, I'm not going to strain it, and allow all the goodness into the primary.

I usually add the honey at the start of the boil, to ensure that it breaks down fully, so I'll dissolve it in the water before I add the any of the Zest.

I'll add the yeast nutrient at flameout, and add the dextrose, maltodextrin, Lactose to the primary before I put in the worts (the boiling one and the heated one)

I've had a bad experience with brown sugar, so i'm not going to include it in the brew. (sorry yard.)

Any other thoughts...?

Trizza.

[Trizza]

Lemonade Update.

Went ahead with the brew as planned - OG at commencement was 1098 (temperature - 22 degrees)
The Safale yeast didn't work - Gravity after two days somehow increased to 1120 (temperature - 20 degrees)

Note - when I took this reading it had been indoors for about 20 mins and
there was several bubbles in the test tube, would this affect the result?
which result do I use as my OG?

The wine yeast is in there now, and bubbling away, though very slowly atm.
This tastes great - but it's going to be a long period of fermentation.

[Toam]

How did this turn out?

[Trizza]

Toam,

It was in primary for 16 days, (Safale didn't work, Lavin QA-23 white wine yeast did)
Secondary for 7 days (removed a shitload of fruit and lost a few liters)
Tertiary for 9 days (added 500g lactose, some of which didn't dissolve)

Bottled a few weeks ago, and its nearly ready to drink - most are still carbing up, might give one a crack on the weekend.

Next time, I'd strain the mix, and use more fruit, some in secondary.

11% alcohol, and at bottling you could really feel it!

It's been 7 weeks since I started this brew, can't wait much longer to give one a go.

Trizza.

[Toam]

Why didn't the Safale work?

I am planning to do a high-alcohol lemonade with a similar to this.

[Trizza]

Why didn't the Safale work?

I'm not entirely sure, because i put in the yeast nutrient and it was at a good temperature at the start. It could have been too acidic for the yeast to live in.

If you're planning a High-Alcoholic Lemonade, Lavin QA23 seems to work out well, although the FG was high at 1020. If you used Lavin EC-1118 you'd end up with higher alcohol, but it would be much drier and probabaly not as good.

Before using the Safale yeast, i hydrated it in some warm water, but 3 days after pitching there was no activity aside from some minor condensation on the lid. (Which i get anyway in all my racked brews, in which fermentation has ceased.)

Anyone have an idea on why Safale wouldn't work under these conditions?

Trizza.

[Trizza]

Tasted it today...

Really great drink!
It hasn't got a strong lemon flavour, its just refreshing with the perfect balance of sweetness and dryness.
The alcohol is very noticeable however, but with age I can expect this to go away with time.

Great Success!

Trizza.

[Toam]

That is excellent to hear!


I am still wonderig this though:

Anyone have an idea on why Safale wouldn't work under these conditions?