Recipe challenge

[Chris]

Ok, I have a challenge for anyone who's game...

Let's see if anyone can come up with a recipe for a beer that involves ONLY steeped grains (hops and water as well obviously). This can include grains that can be mashed, but can only be steeped for this purpose.

Anyone think they can do it? Remember, it must be drinkable...

[drsmurto]

This is going to depend entirely on your steeping process - mine is the ame as my mashing technique.

So no base malts then? ie ale, pils, munich......

[Chris]

Basically yes. You generally need to stick to the highly modified malts.

[Kevnlis]

Palmer has a list of some malts which CAN be steeped but normally SHOULD be mashed. This may make it a bit easier but would also waste quite a bit of grain!

Also another tip, if you right click the columns bar in Beersmith you can add the "must mash" column to your grain section.

Carahell and carapils could easily be used as up to 75% of the base malt.

[rwh]

Er, I don't get it. You need fermentables to make a beer. All the junk you get out of specialty grains is pretty much non-fermentable. So unless you add some malt extract, you'll have a very strange beer.

[Trough Lolly]

Er, I don't get it. You need fermentables to make a beer. All the junk you get out of specialty grains is pretty much non-fermentable. So unless you add some malt extract, you'll have a very strange beer.

...ditto - an attempt was made to do this by a club member earlier this year...result? Undrinkable swill!

Cheers,
TL

[MiniMoose]

even with the lighter crystals?

[Kevnlis]

Carahell has a yield of 75%?

Carapils about the same....

How could this not work? I think I need to do it just to prove the sceptics wrong

[KEG]

we'll wait in eager anticipation for a result then

[Kevnlis]

we'll wait in eager anticipation for a result then

It had to be you...

I will try to make time, my next 6-7 brews are planned, but maybe early next year if I am lucky

[KEG]

it had to be one of the chris's didn't it

[Chris]

Strange is fine- I just want to see if drinkable is possible. I think with combined knowledge that this may be possible. At least Kev's on board!

TL, why was it undrinkable? Too sweet?

[KEG]

hey, if a good beer can be made (i.e better than extract - cos it's not gonna be cheap using specialty grains like that), then i am definitely interested..

[Kevnlis]

Well, carahell has a very light sweetness, and carapils almost none, you could easily mask it with bitter dark grains and hopping IMHO. Though I do not think you could do a light style beer like this.

[Chris]

That was my thought. I recon with the right preparation of the recipe we could pull this off.

[rwh]

Carahell has a yield of 75%? Carapils about the same.... How could this not work?

It has a yeild of 75%, but it's mostly complex unfermentable sugars. Gravity points are not directly related to fermentability.

Maybe if you used some kind of dry enzyme.

I plugged some numbers into the brewcraft calculator. According to it, if you were to make a beer from 4kg of crystal-type grains, you would get an OG of 1.029, a FG of 1.013, 2.7% alc/vol, a massive hole in your wallet, and a disgusting beer.

But I'm looking forward to hearing how the experiments come out now!

[drsmurto]

Pick me, pick me!

I have 2 empty 5L demi johns i was going to fill with experiemental ginger beer, but could give one beer a go using only spec grains.

So we have a guinea pig, how about some sort of recipe?

I thought aiming for something darker would work, add some carafa and roast barley to bulk up the flavours and try and mask the sweetness. Will need a fair whack of IBUs to balance the sweetness tho.

I dont have time to do a full AG this weekend, but a small batch in the kitchen whilst watching the cricket on sunday i can do.

[Chris]

We have a pigeon- I mean brewer...

As a starting point, how about...

300g carahell
250g caramunich
200g carafa I, II or III
150g roast barley

in 5L.

Full wort boil with...

10g perle (60min)
5g perle (45min)
5 perle (20min)

...and any yeast stupid enough to make this beer.

Someone do the maths on this, and see if it needs adjustment.

[Trough Lolly]

Strange is fine- I just want to see if drinkable is possible. I think with combined knowledge that this may be possible. At least Kev's on board!

TL, why was it undrinkable? Too sweet?

Hi Chris,
No, it wasn't too sweet. As rwh pointed out, crystal and all the other steeped malts contribute points to the brew, but they do not generally contribute fermentable sugars to the beer. We need base malts and extract malts (in dry and liquid form) to contribute sucrose and maltose sugars that the yeast can convert. Crystal malts are used to colour the beer and contribute dextrinous compounds that we detect as sweet, caramel, biscuity, nutty etc flavours - but those dextrins are somewhat unfermentable in the wort, which is why we use carapils to promote body in the beer, and they typically result in a higher FG compared to the same brew without carapils in it.
So, you could waste 3kg on light crystal and end up with a hopped solution that has an OG of, say, 1.045 and an FG of 1.043!!

Cheers,
TL

[Chris]

Hmmm... I think you may well be right as far as the OG to FG. When put in those terms, it does seem a little pointless. Up to you now doc. Will the 5L evil liquid ever happen?