About to make my second cider
Will be looking at a sweeter cider this time so a heap more lactose... anyway
Im also looking at a more bubbly champine type of cider.
My questions are
1. could i use a champain yeast to give it more of a champain feel? Would using this make any differance over say a US 05 yeast?
2. if it does make a differance what yeast would you recommed for temps of a round 22deg??
Or am i totally on the wrong track!!
Cider advice
Re: Cider advice
From a post of mine on another forum ......
As for the yeast, I've used champagne in ciders and GBs before but now use the Wyeast cider yeast (#4766).
Lactose wont add a great deal of sweetness to your beer/cider or GB.I realise why people add lactose to ginger beers and ciders but what almost everyone fails to take into account is the fact that lactose is only 20% as sweet as sucrose.
Some back of the napkin calculations for you since its lunch and I'm bored.
Bundaberg Ginger Beer contains ~10g of sugar per 100mL or 100g/L.
That's 2kg in 20L.
Assuming that's a simple sugar such as sucrose and since you need 5 times as much lactose to achieve the same relative sweetness you would need 10kg of lactose in a 20L batch.
This makes a lot of assumptions, the biggest being the nature of the sugar in Bundy GB (and the fact people want to get even close to the sweetness of Bundy GB)
Other examples if you want to judge sweetness are powerade at 60g/L, coke at 100g/L and fanta at 130g/L.
Food for thought.
Cheers
DrSmurto
As for the yeast, I've used champagne in ciders and GBs before but now use the Wyeast cider yeast (#4766).
Re: Cider advice
so if i was looking for sweet cider, never using sucrose before, how much sucrose would you be looking at needing??
Re: Cider advice
Sucrose will ferment out.
You can get a stevia extract in the supermarket these days called Purevia (or similar - look with the artificial sweeteners). Stevia is a natural, unfermentable sweetener. Seen it spoken about a lot in regard to ginger beers and ciders but don't know of anyone reporting actual results. Care to be the guinea pig? Should be enough info on the box to help you do similar calculations as DrSmurto's above.
In regard to getting a champagne like carb - you'll probably need to raise your priming amounts slightly. Not too much of course!
You can get a stevia extract in the supermarket these days called Purevia (or similar - look with the artificial sweeteners). Stevia is a natural, unfermentable sweetener. Seen it spoken about a lot in regard to ginger beers and ciders but don't know of anyone reporting actual results. Care to be the guinea pig? Should be enough info on the box to help you do similar calculations as DrSmurto's above.
In regard to getting a champagne like carb - you'll probably need to raise your priming amounts slightly. Not too much of course!
Re: Cider advice
Hi,
I've brewed ciders with beer yeasts, champers yeasts and proper cider yeasts and here's what I've found:
Champers yeasts tend to dry out your cider. Not brilliant if you're looking for a sweeter beverage. It also takes longer to become drinkable
Proper cider yeast (e.g. the Wyeast strain, can't remember the number) gives a relatively dry cider with lots of the fruit flavour coming through.
Beer yeasts tend to give beer-y flavours, but that is based on a single Brigalow cider batch which was bloody awful
If you're looking for a sweeter brew, check out the artificial sweeteners. If you're kegging, then you don't need to worry. You can stop fermentation when it tastes good to you.
Cheers,
Tim
I've brewed ciders with beer yeasts, champers yeasts and proper cider yeasts and here's what I've found:
Champers yeasts tend to dry out your cider. Not brilliant if you're looking for a sweeter beverage. It also takes longer to become drinkable
Proper cider yeast (e.g. the Wyeast strain, can't remember the number) gives a relatively dry cider with lots of the fruit flavour coming through.
Beer yeasts tend to give beer-y flavours, but that is based on a single Brigalow cider batch which was bloody awful
If you're looking for a sweeter brew, check out the artificial sweeteners. If you're kegging, then you don't need to worry. You can stop fermentation when it tastes good to you.
Cheers,
Tim
Re: Cider advice
Another option is just to make a dry cider and serve with a bit of apple juice to sweeten if necessary. That's what I do. This way you can keep most cider drinkers happy (plus it adds more apple flavour which I usually welcome).
Re: Cider advice
I've never made cider but I have had stevia. I would try it before using, some people like it fine and others hate it. Its also very strong... if you use too much it is very bitter so the amounts may be a little touchy. My mom uses the powder form in baking sometimes.
Re: Cider advice
I made a fantastic cider a couple of months ago and I just used 12 litres of apple juice, 3 litres of water and 500 gm lactose. Boiled the lactose up with an old Coopers yeast for nutrient, then into the fermenter with another Coopers kit yeast. It's lovely and sweet and tastes almost exactly the same as my favourite Magner (sp?). And it's getting better all the time. I carbed the same as beer, with plain old table sugar (6 mg / long neck). Very nice and fizzy! 
Anna
AnnaRe: Cider advice
When we make cider we use pink lady apples I have used granny smiths but these are more acidic so the ladies get it for sweeter style
We use a garden mulched to macerate the apples then press the pulp in our fruit press
After collecting the juice it is run through a 30 micron filter then sterile filtration to remove any wild yeasts
I find that a good white wine yeast or champers yeast does the best job of fermentation and follow recommended fermentation temperatures around 10 degrees
The resulting cider is always going to be dry if left to complete fermentation as all the simple sugars are converted to alcohol
If you want to produce a sweeter drop monitor your fermentation profile and when it gets toward the end of ferment say 1012 sterile filter to remove any yeast then force carbonate or let it go to the end of ferment sterile filter to remove any yeast and add more neat apple juice
And enjoy
This is a little harder with bottled cider as there will be no secondary fermentation but then again still cider is popular
There is nothing like a cold cider on a warm day
The last batch started at around 1055 OG and finished at 1002fg or (13.75 and 0.5 Plato) resulting in 7.1%a/v
As you can see from readings at 1002 it is close to what water is at 1000 so not much sugar left for residual sweetness
Cheers speedie
We use a garden mulched to macerate the apples then press the pulp in our fruit press
After collecting the juice it is run through a 30 micron filter then sterile filtration to remove any wild yeasts
I find that a good white wine yeast or champers yeast does the best job of fermentation and follow recommended fermentation temperatures around 10 degrees
The resulting cider is always going to be dry if left to complete fermentation as all the simple sugars are converted to alcohol
If you want to produce a sweeter drop monitor your fermentation profile and when it gets toward the end of ferment say 1012 sterile filter to remove any yeast then force carbonate or let it go to the end of ferment sterile filter to remove any yeast and add more neat apple juice
And enjoy
This is a little harder with bottled cider as there will be no secondary fermentation but then again still cider is popular
There is nothing like a cold cider on a warm day
The last batch started at around 1055 OG and finished at 1002fg or (13.75 and 0.5 Plato) resulting in 7.1%a/v
As you can see from readings at 1002 it is close to what water is at 1000 so not much sugar left for residual sweetness
Cheers speedie