Carbonation (natural) and head

[T-Bone]

Hi all,

I've been brewing just over 6 months (but have done close to 30 brews) and am noticing that many of my beers seem a bit on the flat side and/or have poor head retention, even after months of conditioning. (Yes I realise this is potentially two different issues.) Though IMO poor head can give the impression of flat-ness anyway. Mostly I have used carb drops for priming but also dextrose, plain sugar etc. I began with kits + dry fermentable ingredients but now generally use liquid malt (or sometimes liquid malt + some dry sugars to bump up alcohol.). I use a mixture of glass & plastic bottles. If anything I believe I am over-careful with sanitisation.

So anyway I'm wondering about the possible cause of my flat-ish beers.

Could some experts comment on the following possibilities please:

1) Ingredients - some things are better for head retention than others - how does using all-malt affect head?

2) Simply not enough priming sugar - do say, Coopers, err on the 'safe' side when it comes to the size of carb drops?

3) Small amounts of residual Sodium Met. in bottles affecting secondary fermentation?

4) Do you fellow brewers invert or (lightly) shake bottles when capped to mix priming sugar? (I haven't tended to do this). Make any difference?

5) I read somwhere that if your wort is very heady when you're first mixing it together, this may detract from the beer's ability to head later (when poured) due to breakdown of enzymes that assist head. Anything in this?

Other possibilities?

Comments appreciated..

[Chewie]

hey t-bone. not sure on most but for these:

1) have heard adding a cup of sultanas to your fermenter just prior to adding yeast guarantees great head retention. Only heard this recently but from a good source... only concern would be what tastes it gives the brew.

2) a mate uses two CCDs per 375ml bottle and still isnt happy with the results. it comes down to how fizzy u like your beer really.

4) yes I do, although I have from day one so not sure if u HAVE to. I know u can invert whenever to kick off dormant yeasties and whatever sugar in the bottle should carbonate.

thats all ive got. good luck

Chewie

[T-Bone]

Thanks for the comments Chewie, I might give the sultanas a go some time. Like you though, I'd be worried about adding (fruit?) flavours to the beer.
Here's an interesting one:
http://www.nrp.org.uk/enews/edpbeer.htm

Two carb drops in a 375ml? That's keen!
Interestingly, if your mate is getting away with that without breakages, maybe carb drops DO under-carbonate!

Cheers.

[Shaun]

I always found plain sugar works fine for carbonation the amount is too small to affect the flavor. I used the yellow double ended scoop to measure it out, large scoop for 750ml small for 375ml. It always gave me good levels of carbonation and a good head.

You could try bulk priming with dextrose or malt I am not a fan of bulk priming but it works for others. If you search here you will find lots of information and instructions on bulk priming.

For your beer head the more malt used in the brew the better it is for the head, you can also use corn syrup/maltodextrin to improve your head I would not use more than 250g in a brew though as it can affect the taste.

Another problem may be the amount of time in the bottle and the temperature you store them at, if they are cool it will take longer to carbonate anywhere from 1 - 2 months. Try giving them more time in the bottle.

As for the sultanas this is the first time I have heard that.

[Wassa]

shaun,

I am not a big fan of carbonation drops, I tend to think they give a course head and either under or over carbonate.

I ue extrose and bulk prime, but their are people who don't like doing this. Ordinary white sugar works well for carbonation and doesn't giv you the cidery taste you get when you ferment with it. As I said, you can use dextrose and their are people who use malt, jelly beans, hih sugar content jams or fresh wort.

I owuld give dextrose a go and see what you think.

[Beerpig]

A small amount of dried wheat malt, add to water, boil & throw in with the rest of your ingredients

Since using this method I haven't had a problem with carbonation & head retention

Cheers

[Mackers]

T-bone,

I've been using carbonation drops for the past 18 months and consider that they give a more even carbonation than using sugar/dextrose and the little measuring dispenser. One thing I hate is a beer that comes out like coca cola. Kits and sugar give notoriously poor heads. Even using a modest amount of grains, such as roasted barley and crystal, etc, improves head retention. A couple of hundred grams of wheat malt also helps and won't affect the flavour.

The other thing to consider is that ales do not normally hold good heads. I spent some months in England drinking ales and they did not have heads on them like a lager. Watch episodes of Inspector Morse, who likes good ales, and you won't see a head on his beers - occasionally just a nice ring or lacing around the glass. Guiness have a laboratory full of scientists and technicians whose sole purpose is to make a head like in their posters. It ain't natural. Home brewed ale is.

[Wassa]

The head on Guiness is the result of using Nitrogen not CO2, something you won't get in brew.

Also, if you over carbonate you will not have good head retention, only high level of froth when pouring.

[Krusty]

If you have been storing them somewhere too cold, they may not gas up at all. I always give mine a good shake after cappng and put them away at 20 deg for a week minimum before putting them in the fridge or into storage. So if you've had your bottled beers out in the cold shed, bring them in, give them all a shake upside down to disperse sugars, and keep them somewhere warm for a week or so.

[T-Bone]

Thanks for the comments people.

I've been storing my bottled beer indoors (around 19deg currently) and as I said, some flat-ish ones a several month old, so I doubt it's just the cooler weather slowing down carbonation.

I'll definitely try the wheat malt idea thanks BeerPig.

And Mackers, you are right about ales (most of my brews have been ales) having less head generally. Perhaps I am expecting too much.

[Beerpig]

No worries T- Bone

Try around 150gms ...................... no need to be too accurate

Cheers

[Chris]

Bulk-prime with malt instead of carb drops. You will get a fine beaded head that lasts, vs beachball bubbles that don't.

As other people said, warm your bottles a bit, and rotate them every day to keep the yeast roused.

Dry-hopping in secondary can also give a better head.

[Aussie Claret]

Quote - Dry-hopping in secondary can also give a better head.
Chris are you sure about that? I would have thought that it was possibly contrary to what you've stated due to the hop oils.

Sorry don't want to wander off topic. I usually keg all my beers except for stout which I like to let age in the bottle and the left overs from kegging which get bottled. I have only ever used carbonation drops for bottling as they are simple to use, one / stubby or 2 / long neck. With stout I use only one drop per long neck.

I have never had a problem with the carbonation level.

AC

[Chris]

AC, I'm in a bit of a grey area here. Some people swear it to be true, others swear the exact opposite. I believe that it works (from my own observation).

[mikey]

No worries T- Bone

Try around 150gms ...................... no need to be too accurate

Cheers

Do you not include the maltodextrin when you use the wheat malt?

[ACTbrewer]

Bulk-prime with malt instead of carb drops. You will get a fine beaded head that lasts, vs beachball bubbles that don't.

I thought I read somewhere that malt was not as predictable an agent for priming.

Do you use it in your brews all the time?


How much malt do you use ( ie a spoonful of dex in a longneck, what is the malt equivalent?)

Cheers

[Chris]

I find malt to be reliable.

I use a priming rate of 300mL per 19L. Usually I use LDM, but sometimes liquid. Just make sure that you account for the solids content, not the volume/weight.

LDM is much easier. Just weigh and dissolve.

I use malt most of the time, but sometimes get lazy and use carb drops. Whenever I do use carbs, I always kick myself. I hate those beachball-sized bubbles.